Saudi Arabia: Beware of the Fine Print

A recent article in Arab News may give fresh hope that progress may be made for children of Saudi fathers and non-Saudi mothers.  However, one must read the text of the article very carefully as it clearly spells out that the goal is if parentage established for the children to be reunited with their father in Saudi Arabia.  There is no mention anywhere in the article about rights of the foreign wife or intent for the foreign wife to accompany her child.

Saudis are very proud of their heritage, their blood and their DNA.  A child fathered by a Saudi male will be looked upon as a Saudi.  However, without a marriage that has been recognized and approved by the Saudi government, the non-Saudi mother of the child and her needs would not be taken into consideration.

In most cases, the non-Saudi mother will be viewed as an immoral woman who took advantage of the weaknesses of the Saudi male.  It probably would not make a difference to most Saudis whether the non-Saudi mother had converted to Islam or not.

Wives of Saudi men are expected to be pure and virtuous; unless a Saudi man chose to marry a widow or divorcee.  Regardless, it is against the religion, culture and heritage for men and women to have intimate relations outside of marriage.

Therefore, if a non-Saudi mother reads the Arab News article and is optimistic that she may be reunited with her lost Saudi beau, she should actually hope for the best but prepare herself for the worse.  In fulfilling her desire to get her child recognized by the Saudi father she may end up losing her child.

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25 Responses

  1. It is certainly to intimidate the women who will stop following up the Saudi father
    If the mother wants the child to be recognized by his Saudi father she has to give up, it’s not fair.

  2. I’m so over Saudis and their precious bloodline/DNA arrogance. Bleh.

  3. One has to wonder about the many women who actually were married (nikah) to the men only to be deceived. A nikah has no legal recognization as a marriage in many places as it is not registered nor recognized by most western countries and most muslims countries choose to overlook it if it is to a western women.

    Really if women know what is best for them and their child(ren) they will stay as far away from Saudi as possible and move on without the deceptive weakling and it’s enabling family or culture which generates lying drooling weakling animals and then actually label them men. At best they are an instinctual animal that can speak.

    By the way their precious bloodline is often fill with genetic abnormalities due to inbreeding.

  4. bigstick1,,, if you talk so awful about Saudi’s ,,, then why do you want to write a book about them

  5. This turned into a big argument last time, but I’m still at a loss as to why anyone who has no intention of living in Saudi Arabia would want Saudi citizenship. I am equally at a loss as to why a child raised in the West, whose Saudi father abandoned them in utero, would want to live in Saudi Arabia. I can see how it might seem better than the alternative for the offspring of misyaar brides in India or the poorer Arab countries, but I can’t imagine anyone raised in the West choosing to do it.

    There aren’t many countries in the world where producing an out-of-wedlock child with a citizen is in itself enough for a foreigner to get permanent residency. Most require a legal marriage, or at least a continuing relationship. Some will give the child citizenship, then allow the child to sponsor the other parent upon reaching adulthood. Saudi citizenship laws are among the strictest in the world, and I can’t imagine them taking such a relaxed stance on this issue.

  6. It’s not because a non-Saudi woman is looked at as an immoral woman who took advantage. It’s because in Islam, a child born out of wedlock is attributed soley to the mother and the father has no responsibility towards the child. The child is not even permitted to take upon his last name and is not allowed inheritance. It wouldn’t matter if she was Lebanese or Kuwaiti! If you have an illegitimate child, that’s how it is. That’s why Muslims should not have sex outside of marriage. I blame the Saudi men who do it when they know the consequences and non-Muslim don’t. They know they do not have to take responsibilty either way, so it’s a free for all

  7. Amal…so what you are saying is that the child is being punished for the “sins” of the parents..and it is condoned by Islamic Law? In this instance (and in many others) western law is far superior to sharia as even if there was no marriage…a father is still a father.

    Interesting personal experience. When I finally divorced my POS ex…he was only ordered to pay Bd150 for 5 children…but then when I sent my daughters to the states to get away from harrassment here…he no longer had to pay for them. Apparently his parentage and responsibility was only enforced when they were within a certain radius to him. He has not paid child support in years because at one time or another they have all been out of the country. I stood before a Sharia judge who basically said…I wont make him pay unless they are in Bahrain (which was not true either as he hasnt paid anything in years…even when they have been here).

  8. Amal:

    Islam teaches men to be irresponsible, bums (no work ethic) and be instinct attack (rape/harass) animals who use there superiority brute force and indoctrination of make believe to control so they can be no more than animals. Then they are taught stupidity like there are 4 times the women born to men which is never the case in the natural world actually it is 106 males born to 100 females born which would suggest the natural order is 1 to 1 not 1 to 4. Ergo again it shows the koran is a manmade farce created for purpose to ensure the male elite not the male poor plenty of female goods (women of course are considered property in all Abrahamic religions). Lest we also not forget that these religions are also great tools which they were designed for of course for dictator or totalitarian governments to control the masses especially those who are less capable of mounting a defense against such governments/dictatorships up to a point. Religion what a tool.

    Your choice of words is unnecessarily rude and insulting. Clean up your comments or you will be put into moderation.
    Moderator.

  9. Coolred, no it is not to punish the child technically, but the parents. Of course some people will treat the child differently but this is wrong as in Islam we do not “inherit the sins of our fathers” (family, parents, etc). Also, if the father marries the mother before she is 3 months, the child will be considered legitimate and attributed to him. As long as the child is born at least 6 months after marriage. This provides the two to “hide their sin” of adultry. However for the people who don’t marry, it’s an illegitimate child as I said earlier.

  10. Bigstick,

    Islam does not promote men to be “lazy bums”. Why is that relevant either way? I know many Muslim men (my husband included) who work 12 hour days everyday to make a living and don’t complain. Please don’t sterotype because of the “rich, lazy Saudi” sterotype ok? There are many hardworking people. And there are also many men with manners who are kind! What is this rape instinct you are talking about. What Muslim men have you met?! Please tell me. What you are doing by saying such things is harmful and irresponsible. You are atheist, but I don’t sterotype atheists as hateful, spiteful jerks. I actually have a friend who is atheist and we get along fine. No need to discuss religion as we get on fine. And surpise, nobody wants to “chop off her head” ;)
    Lastly, I have never heard anything about 4 times more women in the world than men? What are you talking about? Besides, polygyny is not even an obligation. Just allowed. Muslim men aren’t commanded to have multiple wives.

    Try to be nicer please. You catch more bees with honey :)

  11. Amal…you said the child cannot have his name nor inherit from him. That sounds like punishing the child to me.

  12. bigstick where you got this information, I will suggest you to ask about something you don’t know better talking about ( stop being stupid)

    I still dont know where is your right to making insult comment and run away when you say something about religion or culture say your opinion with respect no need to agree but respect

    Oh right you don’t respect humanity at all because they was monkeys before one million years

  13. I don’t think that is necessarily punishing the child to not give him the last name of a father who is even married to his mother or wants nothing to do with him. And he can still recieve inheritance from his mothers side, just not the fathers. With that said, that doesn’t mean the father can’t give the child money if he wants or be involved.. More power to him. & I think punishing the child would be more of name calling or society shunning the child, which is haraam. He shouldn’t pay for his parents sins, no, but in cases of lineage and inheritance, he will unfortunately have to forego being attributed to his father without the protection of marriage. The parents even have a chance to quietly redeem themselves for the sake of the child, but if they don’t, that’s just the way it is in Islam.

  14. Yes, well said american bedu ! I found out too funny when I learnt about the blog “Abandoned Saudi Kids”…Those women are not aware about when a Saudi man recognize his paternity it could be very dangerous ? Much women are here in Saudi Arabia since many years fighting about to go back to their home western countries with their children ( from Saudi father ) while that women are asking about paternity from their Saudi fathers + to come here in Saudi Arabia !!!….Very weird ! A foreign wife of Saudi man has NO any rights in Saudi Arabia and she’s really like nothing, no any value. The Saudi husband has the full right to divorce her at anytime and to kick her out of the kingdom WITHOUT her child of course !!!!!…………..

  15. Abdullah, read up on evolution please, homo sapiens did not ”come from monkeys”, we share a common ancestor. A very different thing.

  16. Seems to me that in most cases, giving the child Saudi citizenship (and giving the father the ability to kidnap him) would be much more of a punishment. I’m continually amazed that women who are net-savvy enough to find Bedu’s blog can’t be bothered to do a bit of googling on Saudi laws and customs before deciding they want to raise their children there.

    Fact: If (for some insane reason) you want your children to have Saudi citizenship, there is exactly one way to do it – through a recognized marriage to a Saudi man. If you choose not to do that, then the consequences are a direct result of your own choice, and you have only yourself to blame. Whether the law is reasonable or fair or hurts children is beside the point; the point is that you were (or should have been) aware of it, and chose to disregard it.

    Upon reading the article again, it seems to be written about children who don’t have mothers. Even if the use of DNA testing ‘allows’ (their words) Saudi fathers to bring their illegitimate children into the Kingdom… why would they choose to do that, seeing as they abandoned the kid in the first place? Is the mother planning to just drop the kid on his doorstep and leave? And what makes Saudi Arabia the kid’s ‘true homeland’, moreso than his mother’s country where he actually lives?

    @Coolred – As I’m sure you know, not all countries have signed the requisite treaties to enforce each other’s custody and child support decrees. This isn’t unique to the Arab world – I personally know two men who’ve moved to Mexico and Singapore for that reason. Fair or not, married or not, a man usually has the option of skipping the country to avoid paying for his kids, and that’s something women should keep in mind when choosing romantic partners. There are practical consequences to having babies with scumbags. That’s just the way the real world works.

  17. My choice of words is what many are doing. Truth is truth. Like it or not. Islam is what is in practice not what you want it to be in the dream world. Saudi is built on the expat and so are places like UAE.

    Of course the moderator is back to censorship again and I didn’t even use profanity.

    How about the education in Saudi and how it refers to Jews as monkeys and pigs? How about the divisiveness of what it teaches and the backwardness that is both the culture and religion? By the way religions are often time created due to the culture not the other way around.

    Islam teaches that women are deficient in mind and religion. It teaches that women are worth less than men. Saudi upholds this and it treats women like perpetual children and insults men by upholding a belief in men having a beast mentality. Like it or not that is the truth or you would not have to have female cities. In addition, Saudi men are taught not morals but how to use women and disregard them and their children like a disposable tissue or they kidnap them and use them against women. Where the heck is the honor in that?

    There is a recent article on the bum aspects of Saudi men as well.

    http://www.saudigazette.com.sa/index.cfm?method=home.regcon&contentid=20120816133300

    Quite frankly women would be better off providing their children with men of quality rather than a culture that promotes intolerance, inequality, discrimination and fairy tales whereby witches are killed and they are in a period of religious inquisition.
    Women need to woman up and stop believing in fairytales and happy endings that have been feed to them in Disney movies. Wise up as these stories are fairytales. First and foremost protect yourself and learn what a predator is and then learn to deal with it.

    There is no such thing as a prince in shining armor ………..life if hard, life has hardship and it is unfair. Deal with it and get on with it. Stop dreaming about a life that has and will never exist otherwise you might find yourself in a nightmare of never having access to your children. Wake up and smell the coffee and get off the delusion drug of but if only because you may pay dearly for it by losing your child and/or children while you are booted out.

    Next no amount of honey is going to keep the flies away from what it is and political correctness is just the white speck on top of chicken poop. The white speck is still poop just packaged differently.

  18. I haven’t read the comment in the ‘Arab News’ yet but from the comments I just read I must say that this is just a way of “saudis’ to pretend that they care about the children that they left behind. Children have a right to know their father, but once these kids meet their Saudi fathers and travel there to meet them, we all know that the kids might never come back with their mother. It is sad to know this but is the truth. If the father wants to meet their kids he should be able to travel wherever the kid lives. But never travel To Saudi Arabia and be exposed to a very different world, different laws and who knows! maybe the father will not accept his own child just because he thinks the his mom is a whore.
    When I was in college there was a girl in my class that had a relationship with a Saudi student, she did get pregnant two months before graduation. His parents came for his graduation, but they also brought this guy’s wife! This poor American girl had her heart broken, not only she was excited to meet his parents, but they also surprised him by bringing his wife and child. I remember that this girl was so heartbroken, that she left the ceremony crying, a week later she had an abortion. It has been 8 years since this happened. We lost contact for several years until last spring I received a facebook request by this girl, and it was her! She graduated, found a job in Seattle, met a wonderful guy ( from Australia) and got married, she now has two beautiful kids. We have not spoken about the Saudi boyfriend she had in college or her abortion. I know is a painful subject. And all of these happened because this Saudi guy lied to her, like many has in the past and like many still do when they come to the U.S.
    I think Saudi society needs a ‘make-over’! All of these social problems happen because ‘men’ are not taught well when they are children. Saudi men, most of them lie, they lie to their women, to their wives, to their parents, and to everyone, even themselves. And the saddest part is that innocent women and children have to pay a price for all these lies.
    I hope that women that read this articles take notes and learn that the Saudi society is very corrupted, and is based in lies and deception.

  19. Bigstick, seems there is just no reasoning with you. You’ve made up your mind to be a hateful person and label every Muslim a piece of crap in your eyes. You bring up topics that have nothing to do with this post, just to rant about how much you hate Saudis by your stereotypes. There is of course problems in Saudi Arabia, no one said it was heaven on earth! But we’re still human beings, and I regard you as such, why can’t you as well instead of looking at me as a heathen or barbarian simply because I am Muslim? Look as Carol for example, her husband was Saudi and he treated her lovely, Mashallah. Everyone is an individual. You’ve never even met Saudis or been to Saudi Arabia.

  20. Amal:

    Go to debate.

  21. @Amal – I don’t believe your account of Islam’s stance on out-of-wedlock children reflects the majority position. I have seen just as many fatwas stating that it is essentially up to the father – if he recognizes the child as his, the child is his, and if he doesn’t, he isn’t.

    @Sunni Side Up – I don’t believe the only path to Saudi citizenship for a child is to be a product of a marriage recognized by the Saudi government. I say this as a wife of a Saudi man and a mother of a child who has a Saudi passport (plus two others). We live in the U.S., have no intention of moving and never sought recognition of our marriage from the Saudi government.

    That said, I can’t fathom why an unmarried mother of a child fathered by a Saudi man would seek Saudi citizenship for the child. Seriously. Why? For validation?

  22. As I read these posts it would seem that the Saudi’s believe in Ethnocentrism.

  23. Every culture believes in ethnocentrism…some are just more open and blatant about it.

  24. Most of the women I have talked to do not want Saudi citizenship for them selves or for their children. This is something that Saudi Arabia says they want to make the children part of their culture and country. Please don’t mistake the women on the blog Abandoned Saudi Children for complete idiots. None want their children to live in a country that treats us like whores . Please believe me that there are no delusions of grandeur here!! The reasons for the blogs abandoned saudi children and saudi children left behind are a way for the women to connect with one another and to serve as a warning for those involved in a sexual relationship with a Saudi man on a student visa.

    Do we want validation? Hell yes we do!!! Most of all we want to protect other women from having to go through what we are currently going through.

    It is easy to say boys will be boys for some people ……but is that how we should raise our sons and daughters? Just because that is the way Saudi men behave does not mean we should just accept it. Can you imagine a world where nothing changed?

  25. In my case, I will never allow my child to go with her father..if he wants to acknowledge his child, then he better visit us in my homeland..I can never trust a Saudi men again..
    I lost contact with the father of my child, but I never tried giving up to contact him..I’m just so lucky that during our relationship I knew he was going to get married and found out about his wife..So, later part while he was in the middle of his honeymoon..I contacted his wife..That’s the time he showed up again, coz I told him I will never hesitate to complain in Embassy and tell his family..I’m not afraid of the consequences..I had nothing to lose! he ruined my life and sooner he will also ruin the life of my child for having an evil, self-absorbed and hypocrite father!!!
    The funny thing is that he was trying to come up with more lies saying that he was jailed and got divorced! And promised to give me whatever i want, including the baby..I pretended to believed him..Sometimes, I want to question God How come he allow this kind of man to enjoy his life while there is a child longing for his care and love..How come he can sleep at night while there is a child he abandoned? How does He Pray everyday??? May Allah enlighten this man..:(((

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