I’m not sure if my title is grammatically correct but as I continue to delve into this post I am confident you as a reader will understand what I am seeking to convey. It’s true… Saudi men are different from most other men in the world and there are simple and not so simple reasons for this fact. To begin with, from the time the Saudi male child is born he is revered. Even if a mother or father had a daughter before giving birth to a son and might have been known as Umm or Abu Ameerah for example, once little Khalid as the first son is born, the mother or father is thereafter known as Umm or Abu Khalid.
And children are smart. A young Saudi boy will quickly notice and learn that he is favored and shown special considerations from his sisters by even as early as two or three years of age. The mothers and grandmothers take such pride and joy in having sons in the family. They are the apple of the eye and shown preferential treatment. Yet at the same time they are also prepared from a young age that they are special but they are also a protector of the women.
The Saudi males are taught by their mothers and grandmothers and aunts they are special and to be spoiled and cuddled. The female relatives will take special care and effort to please the males and rarely question their actions. The father and grandfathers in turn will teach the young men of the responsibilities they have to take care and protect the females in the family. The father and grandfathers also teach the young males to be strong and especially in front of females. The young Saudi male is molded at the earliest age that emotions are not to be shown in front of females and always a show of confidence and responsibility is expected of him.
This does make the Saudi male fiercely protective of the females in his family. Noone dare slander or look at a woman in the family the wrong way as the Saudi male will jump without thought to defend and protect any perceived slight.
As a result, the Saudi male can grow up with a perception of aloofness for in the most traditional of culture, he is raised not to display emotions or feelings or affection. Such displays can be viewed as weakness and question of him and his maturity level or ability to be a good and responsible mahrem (guardian).
The typical Saudi male also grows up in the environment of segregation. Segregation usually starts for him at around the age of 12 years old. One day he enjoyed the loving attention of his Aunts and female cousins and the next day he was viewed as now too mature and expected to remain in the men’s area with the other men. He went from loving attention of Aunts, mother and cousins to the sharp and expectant eyes of Uncles, male cousins and other elder men who would make sure he conducted himself as expected for a Saudi male.
Sure, the Saudi male will have opportunities and chances to have leisure or fun time with classmates or male cousins, but the male dominated environment makes an impact on the Saudi males level of comfort in ultimately interacting with a female relation and particularly a future wife. Again this goes back to when he is a young boy and his role and duties are clearly spelled out for him and he is trained to perform expected duties.
This is in no way to imply that a Saudi man is like a robot devoid of any feelings but instead consider him like an onion with many levels that will need to be peeled back every so slowly to get to that center core. If the Saudi male chooses a traditional relationship through an arranged marriage there will be few if any questions about roles or why is he like he is. The questions seem to come most from love matches (such as Saudis who are not related but do marry) and the bi-cultural marriages where each family has brought some of its own customs and cultures into the relationship.
A relationship with a Saudi male is very special. It will require patience and much understanding. It will require compromise and lots of effort at communication. And while that may sound like always work, I can personally attest, it is well worth it! And in sum, just remember that while the Saudi man may be a little different, it was his heritage which made him that way and treasure the best of it.
Filed under: America, Freedoms, Saudi Arabia, Saudi Living, Saudi culture, Saudi customs, Saudi education, culture, gender, relationships, religion, travel | Tagged: America, culture, culture shock, customs, gender, gender issues, heritage, history, KSA, places, Relationship, Saudi, Saudi Arabia, Saudi culture, Saudi customs
the thing that I was thinking about while reading this is that the male is removed from his female environment at the MOST impressionable moment of his life… just as he is coming into a world filled with hormones and confusing questions about his own sexuality and that of females. It is unfortunate that he is not allowed to continue in the female environment for at least a few more years where he could develop more in his attitudes toward girls/women. I think it is also sad that the girls of the family are not exposed to some of the “special treatment” that the boys get. Is it that the women spoil the boys because in a weird way by giving birth to them they have secured their stature in society? Just a thought.
Along the lines of Oby, I have often wondered that myself. Could it be in part because the men hold the money and power in society? I’m wondering if at least subconsciously the females are forming an alliance with that male child for their future benefit, should they need him.
In my husband’s family I have seen the female children cherished just as much, but it is kinda funny when my husband visits, he gets the royal treatment from the female members of his family
@Oby, Kristine,
And don’t forget….the female has a similar experience when she reaches puberty as well in that she does not play or mix with male cousins.
I also did not mean to imply in any way that females weren’t cherished and loved. They are while at the same time, in many cases, there is a marked distinction with the male.
I need to have some of the Saudis here respond but I do think tradition and heritage play a large role as well as being a male dominated society.
well, its one of complicated issues ! i think the case of segregation btt male and female is in exaggerating..its for sure the full environment of segregation is effect the life to be unnatural and this what the life in Saudi looks like.. absolutely, the segregation is must but not for this like…a Saudi women and single male who are the biggest harm.
i have a proposal for ya, carol …i guess if you changed the style & size of font, it would be more attractive to reading….i guess so !
@Mohammed,
I’m using aerial 14 for posts. What would be easier?
Hmm I want to throw something out there.. its not per say about Saudi men, but about Saudi men and women. Basically when the newly weds are alone for the first time.. for many its a dreadful night.. the Man is either too eager or too exhausted.. there are a lot of stories how could this happen.. some end up with a divorce overnight.. others end up building a relationship that is very special.. Fact is, the Saudi lady would have this alien man introduced to her on her wedding night who might approach her to intimately, too fast… while she was conditioned all her life to fear the Alien man.. this doesn’t happen to all Saudi women, but it does happen a lot.
I heard stories where the couple entered the room, the bride was shaking, he was exhausted and removed his head cover only for her to burst into tears going, Khalaas khalaas, I’ll do anything you want.. he was surprised by this.. he calmed her down, explained to her that she doesn’t need to fear him as she is his wife and he wouldn’t do wrong to her. He called the lobby, ordered a mint and lemon juice, ordered dinner and let her calm down and they had dinner together then he slept on the couch for his first night.. they became intimate by the third day and I guess they developed a very strong relationship from this.
in another story I got to hear, he husband waited for three weeks for his wife to drop her guard against him.
Not all of it will go like this however, some Men, especially the type that like to prove their manly-hood, like to satisfy their sexual desire on the first night.. they will be too eager to get this done so they can brag about it or feel satisfied with their accomplishment.. that they are now true men.
DW – thank you very much for sharing this candid comment. This illustrates why it is so important for young men and young women to have someone they know, trust and feel comfortable with to explain to them expectations, emotions and fears. It’s like the young bride is protected like a precious flower and then on the wedding night, it could be the worse nightmare or insha’allah, she will have a sensitive and understanding husband who will reassure her and as you said, let her overcome fears and get to know her spouse before becoming intimate. Probably similar to you, I am aware of newlyweds who return from honeymoon’s divorced and the young woman is even more leary and fearful at the thought of remarriage.
@DW…
It is a VERY wise man that puts his desires second to his very frightened wife’s.
The man who forces himself on his wife has NO IDEA that by waiting and taking it slow and letting her call the shots sexually she will eventually come to him willingly and for the rest of her life feel love for him for having such respect for her feelings…and most likely he will be blessed with a life full of wonderful intimacy because he waited at the very first.
@OBY – off topic but did you receive my email? It was sent by my private email so might have gone to your spam!
amm i dont know… any size of font is bigger than this it would be better….if u can or forget about it
@Mohammed,
Walmart sells non-perscription glasses if you need some magnification
2 XD
In fact Saudi Arabia shares the preference given to male child with many traditional societies. It has to do with the propagation of the family line and in context of Saudi society, the preferential laws the orthodox Islam has ordained in favour of men – laws related to men’s place in society, to inheritence, their weight as legal witnesses, their status as mahram who decide every aspect of women’s lives and so on.
Unless Saudi Arabia abandons this orthodox Islam, these kinds of gender-based inequalities can’t die.
In Saudi Arabia – as also in other traditional societies, these male-oriented preferences are often fostered by the women – the mothers, wives, sisters and daughters of men. That’s because they feel that in absence of an equal society, the closer they stay to a strong and powerful man, the better their own condition will be. Hence, fighting for one’s own place in society would be foolhardy in such a situation. It’s perhaps an easier route to comfort to pamper the man around whom their life revolves.
good points Daisy!
Thanks, Carol.
Mohammed USA,
You may go to top menu, click “view”, – click “text size” – click the desired size you want.
Carol,
You may experiment with Georgia if you like – it’s a bigger size font and has attractive-shaped characters.
thanks for the tips Daisy!
lol re: fonts….have you EVER tried to read arabic in a small font??? Most arabs forget to chenge the size OMG it’s impossible!!!
OK back to the point…
Carol…
Thanks for the heads up. I did find it in spam…thanks for the response…Is it OK to contact you in the next day or so? Finally…a quiet house.
arbgrlusa – oh my gosh yes…and when reading the arabic newspapers too I always have to enlarge the text.
Oby – it would be wonderful to hear from you. Wednesday is chemo day so that day would not be a good day as I’ll be pretty loopy! (smile)
You shed a bright light on Saudi men. I can understand why. You are married to one. How do you explain their rudeness and aggressiveness on the road? I have been teaching for 30 years, the last 3 here in the KSA. I have never seen so much cheating and lying in my life. Explain that.
I have a former post on that same subject. My spouse in fact commented that when Saudis know one another they want to be polite and show their best face yet these same individuals will be aggressive and rude on the road.It is as if society accepts the rude and aggressive driving since most of the individuals are unknown and therefore no need to show the best face.
The lying and cheating is culture based. Rather than disappoint it is okay to lie or not tell the whole truth. By cheating, are you referring to students exchanging info via text messages?
Your comment does highlight the negative traits seen in some Saudis.
I mean all kinds of cheating during exams. The list of innovative methods goes on and on. Cheat sheets, writing on hands and legs, hand signals, writing on erasers and then sharing the erasers. But what gets me is their denials after getting caught. It’s laughable. But, then again, I am not here to change the culture.
As a teacher, would you say that cheating seems to be more prominent among Saudi students in Saudi than with students in other places? And if so, why?
Men in Saudi are God! They are spoilt and given precedence before their sisters. Especially after puberty.
But then they also get excluded from any kind of female contact except their mother and sisters. Getting completely frustrated about sex.
They can do whatever they like, nobody will blame them. It’s always the fault of their friends or anybody but they are never to blame. They can tell not only their sister what to do but even their mothers! A 60 year old woman still needs a man’s permission to travel Even if her only Mahram is her 14 year old grandson! What does this do the the thoughts of the 14 year old boy?
Everything in society tells them they are the important ones. The boys schools are better than the girl’s schools. In Kaust the men’s gym is much better than the woman’s gym.
They can beat up their sisters and not get punished. They can beat up their wives and will not be punished. They can do whatever they want to any woman under their control.
They can find drugs and alcohol. You only have to keep it secret. They can meet women if they keep it secret. They can have sex with men if they keep it secret.
A mix between absolute power. Always having to do everything on the sly. Being spoilt brats who think they have a right to everything they desire. This makes so many saudi men what they are.
Save the Women – Strong comments but in many cases of Saudi men, very true. So how would one, does one, change these practices?
It is not unusual to learn that both Saudi men and women have had relations with the same gender. And they would not view it as homosexuality or think of being gay (and they likely are not) but segregation and curiosity and puberty can lead to experimentation. The changes which occur with puberty are typically not discussed either in school or elsewhere.
I remember being at souk Mecca in Riyadh earlier this decade, and I remember people openly selling school test answers, I think it was for high school or university. I was outright shocked and dismayed.
@ Carol, that is another thing that was really difficult for me. I would much rather be disappointed and told the truth than lied to. THAT disappoints me more than anything!
@Kristine – I understand. At the same time, the Eastern/Arab culture is also based on do not disappoint even if it means to lie because in the individuals perspective, they are not lying even though as a westerner we view their words as a lie.
No, Indians surpass everyone else in cheating!
@ American Bedu, I did sort of think of the ”nasty Saudi”. There are Saudi men who did not get everything thrown in their lap. Who actually studied for their degrees. Who, instead of thrashing their fathers cars at 15 were little entrepeneurs and EARNED their cars.
But still it is true most of the time men get the best. The best room in the house is the men’s room. Women are cherished, but only after the men got in first. And after they got waited one like little kings. It is inevitable that such treatment will twist the head of most men.
This can only be changed by new parents.
But then there is the very heavy pressure of society as well.
I think the Saudi men who had an unusual upbringing, abroad or less affluent, turn out the best.
I think it is the outcome of extreme segregation which drives so many into a same sex relationship. I think the phonomenon is often observed in situations when humans are being kept in a single sex environment. And in Saudi it is always so. After marriage men and women keep on leading their segregated lives!
This is typical of the façade: on the outside homosexuality or homosexual acts do not exist. But I have heard that Jeddah and Riyadh are a gays heaven! For men it is only the bottom one who is to blame. The man on top is still a man. And usual the ”bottom” is a young boy, and his part is seen as a youthful mistake. And nobody considers themselves homosexual.
@Carol, I understand that concept intellectually, but it was difficult to really GET it. As a diplomat, you must have had a working understanding of the lying vs. disappointing. To me trust is the whole issue. How were you able to adapt? Did it take a long time? How do you know if something is really true? Or at some point does it matter? For me, I just felt a lot of disappointment. Maybe it was the judgemental part of me?
@Kristine,
I hope that these two earlier posts help in understanding and specifically addressing your question:
http://americanbedu.com/2008/05/05/do-all-saudis-routinely-lie/
http://americanbedu.com/2009/09/06/the-saudi-insha%E2%80%99allah/
If not, please let me know!
More prominent does not even come close. Students in Europe where I taught had to work hard to succeed in life. There were no handouts. As for the Saudis, I don’t know. I can only guess. Lack of motivation? Even if they fail, they have the family to back them up? No sense of being deprived of anything, so why work hard to get ti? They all want to be managers without any qualifications? You tell me.
I do agree that there seems to be a higher lack of motivation and less discipline. Yet on the other hand, those who are motivated and disciplined do stand out for their dedication and desire. In sum, it is not easy to be a teacher in Saudi.
i guess a lot of the behaviour fits into the shame based model, where appearance takes precedence.
i think shame based cultures seem to go against islam which places importance on intention, not being two faced etc…
i am curious about this, are western cultures (guilt based ones) closer to Islam than they think?
i think even in the west you see the male privilege thing in the relationship with the mother-in law. the mother-in-law, if she hates, always seems to hate her daugter-in -law, rarely the son-in-law. (a suconcious allinace, as previously mentioned)
good comment. I like the comparisons and shame based model is also aptly named.
there actually are many many similarities to the true and peaceful Islam with other faiths.
I forgot to follow up with this entry, December been busy here..
I’ll offer some points about cheating and lies.. the problem stems from the Educational System in Saudi Arabia.. its based on a view that you only have to pass not study. You should memorize what you learn.. do your tests and then throw everything you learned out the window. So Education is not valuable after finishing the tests required for them.. the problem for the student then becomes how can I pass this test any way possible. This system also forced good and smart students to cheat as well.. because when they target their next academic step.. its always restricted by their commutative score or science classes scores.. this student who might want to get into dental medicine for example is required by the college to get 95% in high school. A student who might want to become a doctor all his life might have his dream crushed cause a teacher who hates him decided to down score him.. he might end up with 92% or 85%.. he would cheat his way to full scores so he can graduate with the highest score possible. In all honesty I never seen the point to need such a high score.. and those colleges and universities should stop being lazy and concentrate on aptitude tests to select their admissions. Saudi students who are pressured to succeed or pass will resort to anything from “super” ass kissing powers to cheating or bribes.
why do most who are caught cheating would lie.. well they say he who steals an egg tomorrow steals a camel. Most of them will try to play their card that the teacher is only suspicious with them or that they can pressure him into backing up from a punishment to just a warning so they can continue the test.
Megalos Poutsos, if you teach at a private institute I believe I already deal with this problem myself. I test English for the purpose of recruitment in the government sector I work for. I occasionally get asked by candidates that don’t score well about courses or institutes to improve their English. I seen many who took long courses in English and did not benefit.. or those who went abroad and did not benefit. The reason is simple but critical.. most of them went to get the course/degree and not to learn English. They confuse between the method and the goal by concentrating to pass the method without achieving the goal. Thats why I advise most of them, especially who have very slim chances to develop in short periods of time to only consider improving their English in methods that doesn’t cost them financially… as such as free course or internship into a training facility.. Also Saudis who go abroad.. it very important to stress to them that they are there to study English first and foremost and while social activity is a great tool to learn the language.. its useless when you are smoking hubbly bubbly on the beach with your Arab/gulf friends and teaching the spanish girl next to you in class to belly dance and speak habibi arabic.
DW – I love your comment and believe you summed up the challenges and explained the Saudi student mindset very well.
I have hopes that in time the entire Saudi educational system will be reformed and shifted away from rote memorization.
“its useless when you are smoking hubbly bubbly on the beach with your Arab/gulf friends and teaching the spanish girl next to you in class to belly dance and speak habibi arabic.”
LOL!
Hi there, I enjoyed reading your post about how Saudi males grow up, and I find most of it applies to me personally. what you have mentioned about how segregation affects the way a Saudi man deal with a “stranger” female is completly true due to the segregated life style we have in Saudi
.I am a Saudi student in the U.S right now, and I REALLY have a problem dealing with females in general, even in Saudi. Most of my close friends would tell me the same thing too. Me and my friends always blame the government and it’s religious system, we always say that our parents and grandparents weren’t like us in the way they delt with women, and that’s true, my Bedouin aunt may she rest in peace was used to show her face to every one, and also she was well know among men for her strong character, also she used to expect men, even if she was alone in the house, we always bring up these things and make comparisons when we discuses the matter of dealing with the opposite sex,
I just wanted to share that with you
Thank you.
Welcome H.Z. and thank you for your candid comment.
I hope that you will continue to share other experiences and views too so we all can continue to learn from each other.
Regards, American Bedu