A common theme when a non-Saudi woman speaks about a Saudi man is typically how charming and personable he is. And those non-Saudi women who marry a Saudi man will also reinforce that his charm, his personality, his way of making a woman feel very unique and especially loved were traits which captured her heart and drew her to him. I happen to agree that Saudi men do have a special charm and personality that can seem like it hypnotizes a woman. Is it the extra measure of care and protectiveness along with the charm that make the Saudi man a powerful magnet as compared to non-Saudi men? Is it because Saudi men have grown up in an environment where they are expected to cherish and care for the women in their life that teaches them to be a master at making a woman smile and feel special? Do Saudi men feel more of an obligation than perhaps Western men to not hurt or disappoint a woman in their life? These seem to be influencing factors and traits in relationships between Saudi men and non-Saudi women. But I’d like to know, what do the Saudi women think? Are the perceptions of non-Saudi women about the Saudi man accurate? Why or why not?
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saudi men are charming !!! noway, i am a saudi and have had bad experiences so maybe my voice shouldn’t be counted.
Well, yea, I am sure they can be charming until they get what they want!! But then again, to be honest, that’s all men! lol The difference though is that Saudi society , in general, is set up to benefit the men period! Then you also have a religious establishment that is dedicated to preserving male privilege and supremacy.
Also, I think that where as a non-Saudi woman finds a Saudi man charming, for a Saudi woman we know what they are like and they are rather mundane and usual. Perhaps, to a non-Saudi woman, the charm stems from the fact that they are a novelty.
Where as all men CAN be this way, not all men have these same forces backing their play. Of course this is just my opinion, but then again, my opinion as a Saudi woman doesn’t mean much…lol!
Saudi men have a VERY VERY bad rap here. Everyone I know avoids them and is well aware that the charm is temporary. Same thing for other khaliji men.
Well..since I am a Saudi woman, I guess I must have a say here
Any opinion about Saudi men or American men or French men is never objective. We all form our opinion based on our personal experiences.
For me things are a little different. First of all, I have to clarify that I don’t like Saudi women that much (not all of them of course) and I have my reasons mentioned here:
http://saudirevelations.wordpress.com/2009/11/28/saudi-womens-oppression-vs-muslim-womens-mission-part-i/
So, I think my opinion of Saudi men doesn’t really count
But here goes…
I think Saudi men are more reasonalble and knowledgable than Saudi women..they’re actually much more fun to be with…I have two younger brothers and beleive me i enjoy hanging out with them much more than i do with my girl friends…
Based on my relationship with my father, brothers, and husband, I say that I LOVE Saudi men! Each one of them (mashaAllah) is exceptional in his own way. Most men in my family are highly educated and very respectful with their wives (except for one who has two wives, and no one in the family likes or respects him).
there are also other Saudi men who are really great and are a source of pride to any Saudi…
To mention a few only:
Mohammad Al-Rotayyan (insightful writer whose wroks have been translated into many languages)
Ahmad Al-Shugairi (has a successful TV program)
Abdullah al-Jifry – a very sensitive and emotianl writer (may his soul rest in peace)
Abed Khazendar (writer)
Mohammad al-Harthi (Chief editor of Sayidaty magazine)
Abdullah Bajubair (writer)
Dr. Waleed Fetaihi – Owner and manager of IMC (International Medical Center)
I haven’t known those men in person, but what they are giving the Saudi society is invaluable.
Thanks Carol for this post…
Stay tuned for my exclusive interview and post titled (Great Saudi Men)…it’s still in process, and I hope to finish all the interviews in six months time.
Thanks Maha! I like how you have identified specific Saudi men. A few of them I had heard of but most of them I had not.
hmm, am a non-saudi woman, so I should remain silent..
looking forward to see more reactions…
Ps. now that I’ve learned so much from this blog, I think I am immune for any Saudi man…however kind he might seem to be
In my last 2-yrs of University we had this HUGE influx of Saudi students, particularly men (althought there were some single and married women students too)
And let me tell you, a lot of them behaved really atrociously, it was so embarrassing, as a Muslim seeing how these guys would behave.
My husband was moonlighting at a Pizza Parlor and everyone he worked with was Saudi and in the US for school (they did later get in trouble with the ministry for working on the sly) and their behavior was quite disgusting, they would show up to work drunk, with girls…and occasionally my husband would have to field calls from their concern parents and one even had a wife back home…they would call, ask to speak to them and he’d have to cover up their sins.
yuck.
They would come on to a lot of the female students and even the students who were Muslim and covered! several times I would be out around campus, fully covered and have some leer at me, or say something to me…twice I even had them sing to me in the computer lab. Once my husband was nearby and I called him over and he had to threaten the guy. One 1 level…ok I can understand going after a non-Muslim girl who is in tight, skimpy clothing and maybe acting ditzy…but to go after a MARRIED, Muslim women totally covered up. C’mon!
yuck!
I also had the misfortune to ahve several female classmates go and ask me about Saudi culture and men because they were “seeing” Saudi male students, I always told them to watch out and that they will NOT marry you, you’re just giving them what they want. They have no respect for you. Now if the girl was a muslim, religious and knew what she was doing, thats another thing…like if they were going about it the Islamic way. No dating…just intention to marry and both sets of parents being informed and then getting married, quickly according to the sunnah then I’m sure there would be no problems because then there is religion involved and families are involved. Similar to marrying a Saudi women.
I’m not Saudi, neither is my husband (we r Persian background)…but I understood their mentality and understood why these guys were deceiving the girls they were dating.
As par Saudi women…I don’t know…I have a few Saudi female friends here so maybe I’ll ask them, but frankly…I think they are just raised to pay no mind to the guys behavior, it doesnt seem like husbands and wives here have very good relations, like they are married, they have kids but there is a wall between them. I never see them being silly together, or laughing together or even really socializing together, as long as the guy is providing for his family and takes them out to the mall, it doesnt really seem to matter.
Maybe I’m wrong, but thats how it appears.
aww umm ibrahim, that’s plain bad behavior. no one should be subject to that, irrespective of if they were modest or not.
Unlike your statement , I really can’t understand them going after non-muslims, skimpily clad women either.
Muslim/non-muslim/modest/immodest – people come in al shapes and sizes, so let’s not label anyone. however a women dresses/ whatever religion she follows , the behavior you described is BAD… really reflects on his terrible upbringing and quite deserving of a tight slap.
I’ve met a few saudi students , yes i know about their partying lifestyle. including drinking/partying/multiple affairs, they are just like any others who have been in a tight cage and then let loose without being taught basic rules of behavior. I’ve also met the sweet ones who’s main focus in life is the 4.0 GPA.
I agree…the charm is usually temporary until their objective has been achieved
Umm ibrahim, interesting comment, thank you for sharing.
But I agree with Radha, no woman should be subject to bad behaviour wether she is ”modest” or not.
And what is modesty? You cannot judge people’s ”modesty” on being covered or not. especially when you are for example in America, you can’t consider American women without headcovering to be ‘immodest”???
You cannot consider any woman with uncovered hair immodest anyway.
No honest man would subject a woman to bad treatment however she dresses.
I think these guys get a lot of their succes because they are very clear to the girl that they will have a future together, marriage, children, grow old together while being partners, friends, lovers. The ”western” ideal. While all the time they are telling big, big lies.
I will keep my list of worthwhile Saudi men until we get the post about the existence of cool Saudi men. Because of course there are some.
One or two…
Um Ibrahim, ‘ok I can understand going after a non-Muslim girl who is in tight, skimpy clothing and maybe acting ditzy…’
So would that excuse him?
Unfortunately, most of the Saudis who are sent to America are Beduoins who come straight from the village to America, which is surly a cultural shock for them. They don’t just lack manners; they lack basic knowledge of Islamic values.
But again, as some have said earlier in this post, men can be jerks whether they’re Saudis, Americans, or French.
And women, whether Americans or Saudis must not allow men to deal with them in a bad or demeaning way. If you want a man or love him; teach him how to treat you and respect you. If he doesn’t learn, he’s not worth your love.
In other words, be a bitch as Sherry Argov puts in her book Why Men Marry Bitches? Very good tips for those of you who are in a relationship, and the tips (though written for Americans) work with Saudi men as well
where the heck are the moms and dads of these jerks? i respectfully mean all jerks – not just saudi. I promise if my son did something so stupid , at the very least i’d sit him down for a tongue lashing and a slap up his head ,at worst he’d pay dearly for his misstep…
i have my sources / my snitch in place.
and i’d know
even otherwise, some manners, respect for another human and way to treat women should be dinned into their brain, in addition to making sure he gets his vitamins and math, parents need to make sure he understands what being a good human being means, this i say irrespective of what religion he follows or what his religious book says.
@Aafke, you are so right, i sent pics to my parents and called this weekend to receive a tongue lashing from my very very old , almost cannot see grandmom on my daughters dress and my capability as a mom . she was wearing one of those long sweaters, apparently my grandmom missed the leggings
just saying, what’s modest to me may not necessarily mean the same to someone else, someone who wanted to know why the heck my “almost a woman” daughter was wearing such a small frock and posing in it 
After reading some comments here, I started wondering; why do American women fall for Suadi men in the first place? Aren’t there enough American men around?
Even if the Saudi man appeared to be charming, why bother and get involved with someone who came from the other side of the world?
I am sure there are many charming American men out there, so why do American women fall for Saudis? I’m sure it’s not just because the Saudi men over there know how to present themsleves…
I think the attitude and perception of the American women must be questioned here…. Does the average American woman lack experience and insights?
I tried to put myself in your shoes, but I failed to understand why…
let’s say…I am an American woman…I am totally free and educated….I know many American men whether in school, college or at work…I understand them and they understand me…we share a cultrual background…we share so many other things….he looks at me as an equal human being…
If I have all of this, why on Earth would I get involved with a Saudi?
I know many Muslim American women who are married to Saudis and they are happy with them…their reasons for marrying them are very convincing…they are looking for security …and their goal from the begnning was to live in Saudi Arabia as they believe it helps them become better Muslims….
but to be a non-Muslim and get involved with a Saudi Beduoin man? that’s something I can never understand…
To be in love with your country and culture and then love a man who comes from a totally different culture? Why?
Love is not a cultural journey where you explore different countries and customs….love means unity…
Sorry, but i had to let this out..it’s a question that’s been bugging me for a while and i hope you have convincing answers
thanks
to the comment above, I’m not american , i’m indian , not a muslim and i’m married to a saudi, well ok a very indianised Saudi . as to why, why not? he’s a human being right, male . why would i not find him attractive and compatible just because he’s born in a diff land and follows a diff god ?
I got married because he was my best friend and soulmate thru 5 yrs of schooling/ hostel life and tough times. it was easy being with him, he got my thoughts ,joy and my desires. he was respectful and fun and mostly he tried his best to fit in to what he thought my family expected. which was thoughtful but unnecessary. sometimes you meet a person and after a few years you realise that he is your partner , your goals are the same and at that time you have to grab with both hands, nationality and religion shouldn’t play any role at that time.
Just like there are some people no matter how good you cannot stand , there are some who you need near you.
As for americans falling for the saudi students in droves, 3 months/6 months even a yr is just enough time to be friends …take it slow and see..and forget the exotic factor, they are NOT exotic.. just human.
Thanks radha for sharing your experience…I am not against multi-cultural marriages as I come from a multi-cultural family, and my question wasn’t put to deny the rights of any human marrying from another nationality…but my question was to the American ladies who keep complaining from Saudi men…why do they put themsleves in such a situation?
Your marriage was successful because you’ve known your husband and you’ve chosen him based on reason, not because you found him prince charming…it’s because you rationalized your emotions…
Thank you so mcuh for sharing your experience…
still waiting for the American ladies to answer my questions…
Why do you get involved with a man from a culture that you don’t think high of while you have amazing Americans around you?
@radha
by the way..my name is Maha Noor Elahi…a Saudi who is half Iraqi , half Indian
A good question for discussion Maha. My theory is that unlike a lot of American men, the Saudi man has this way of making the woman feel very cherished, protected and feminine. They are very attentive. They will many times interact with the family. They will spend time with mom and dad. In general they will show themselves are more polite and courteous, kind of old school. At least in my view those are the initial “lures” that attract the American woman to the Saudi.
Just catching up with my Bedu reading…sorry to comment on an older post, but I couldn’t resist. Sorry to disappoint Maha, but I am yet another Saudi woman although quite westernized.
I have noticed that the arab guys at school are very popular in general, which I think might be because of 1. their looks and 2. they are trying very hard to get girls. Regarding the saudi men or khaleeji in general, I find that many of my American gfs think we are all rich. They also think saudi women have a fine life, eating bonbons and having children, all the while wearing designer clothes. They may be in total “re”action to the demanding lifestyle of the American woman. The average american woman has no concept of what life is really like for women in KSA, nor how her life would change once her saudi husband returned home.
Occasionally, I will meet the American convert who thinks marrying a saudi will enhance her practice !? This is like saying all Americans are great Christians.
I find the whole thing very aggravating. As one who is practically forced to marry a saudi man, I say you can have them.
sorry, to continue my rant. I just want to apologize to Carol and Susie who seem to have fine husbands and families.
Frankly, I am sick of the stereotypes and how the saudi guys here play into them. They avoid me like the plague cuz they know what I know. The other arab guys come on really strong to me, for the same reasons i mentioned above. They think we are holy, pious, rich, etc.
This is probably somewhat a taboo topic, but other arabs and westerners think we have a monopoly on eroticism. It must be our “skimpy and skin-tight clothing” lol. Seriously, most westerners I know want to know about our sex lives. Is it the polygamy? The old films of harems?? I have no idea.
I think that the attention might at least catch her attention. Americans aren’t so “flowery” or “charming”. or “old world” as Carol put it. In other words I am not sure that they whisper sweet nothings as well as a Saudi.
And they can be very persistent.
when I was in graduate school there was a man in my class with whom I became casual friends…no more than casual chatting. I have no idea what got into his head because we were NOT more than casual, but he decided that he liked me more and chased and chased and chased. I was very nice at first in my refusal of his attentions because it was a really small school and there was no way to avoid him…he was in all my classes. Plus, we had been on good terms for a year or so. I tried to tell him nicely no thank you, I only consider you a friend. I tried explaining it to his American friends in the hope that they could get the message across. I was afraid to engage him more than I had to. Finally,. I got down right ugly after months and months of this and after several very sharp “leave me alone’s” he got the hint. This guy was not going back to his home country as he was a green card holder or citizen although he evidently he was a first(and recent ) generation. I have no idea if he was Saudi…or even Muslim for that matter. we weren’t even that close. But he WAS from the Middle East somewhere. Anyway…that was my experience and rather than finding it flattering I found it to be a pain. I think if someone says no thank you a few times a man should get the hint.
@mariam
You didn’t dissappoint me, dear. As I said earlier, our opinions will always be different and never objective based on our personal experiences. If a woman – Saudi or non-Saudi-was abused by a Saudi man or belittled or beaten, I can never blame her for wishing to kill the ba***!
But again, good men exist in Saudi Arabia and in America…and the bad ones, too…
you just need to be wise to find one
I have an aunt who refused to marry a Saudi whatsoever…she got married to 5 men (one at a time)
of 4 different nationalities…she is divorced now….and is still searching for Mr Right (whom I think will never show up) 
I beleive that women should learn to rationalize their emotions..they should be educated on how to love smart…when to give and when not to give…how to see the disaster coming before it damages her…
After all, any relationship is the responsibility of two; the man and the woman…if a woman is abused , I don’t blame the man only (of course he’s a jerk), but I blame her for being a door mat willingly…what to expect from a man if you make of yourslef a door mat? He’ll surly step on you and then blame you if you complain….
why on earth will a man marry you if he’s getting what he wants without marriage? that goes for Americans and Saudis… and don’t tell me this is a Saudi concept… I read this in many american books dealing with women who can’t get their boyfriends to commit to marriage….
As much as I hate jerks of all nationalities , I hate women who are driven by their emotions in a stupid way…Picture this: a young woman going out with a man…giving him all the sexual pleasure he wants…does not ask him to pay her bills or to buy her clothes… she makes herslef an object for his pleasure in every sense…after that, he just dumps her…I wonder why she couldn’t see it coming!
Charming or not charming; you should teach him how to respect you, and if he doesn’t, he’s not worth your love.
and that’s not about Saudi men only; it;s about all men..
You have to understand men’s nature fully before you go on a relationship whether it’s with a Saudi or American…
By the way, mariam, you’re quite right about the sensational image westerners have about us…and it’s true to some extent…I know for sure our men are hotter
and that’s part of their charm, but it’s still not an excuse for a wise woman….
yi yi Maha…I think ME men in general more in pusuit of their own sexual pleasure. Which doesn’t necessarily make it a fab experience for women. If they are hotter – …cuz they can’t get “it” easily.
And I totally agree with the persistance thing with Arab men. They are taught that from an early age.
Loved the cautionary tale re: your aunt with five successive husbands. I’ll report back in a few years and let you know. Yeah, it would be great to find someone who understood my culture. I’m dabbling in Qatari waters right now. (As Carol, my mother hen, rolls her eyes.)
“Picture this: a young woman going out with a man…giving him all the sexual pleasure he wants…does not ask him to pay her bills or to buy her clothes… she makes herslef an object for his pleasure in every sense”
Uh Maha
You mean that young women do not get sexual pleasure from, well, sex? And if he is not good in bed she can’t drop him, like a hot potato he is?And if he will not pay her for going to bed with him by buying her clothes or paying her bills she is ……what?
Just asking.
Carol,
I mix with men of many ethnicities and somehow American men are always very nice to me. Of course I find the British men the most polite and courteous of all – Americans a little less so. I wish the Indian men would learn some politeness and courtesy from them! But the West Asian men I have met don’t appeal to me that much – they are very much like the Indian men, only they are more soft spoken. Yes, I do feel they pester a woman too much and a pain in the neck as Oby described.
@Maha:
“Why on earth will a man marry you if he’s getting what he wants without marriage?”
I don’t suppose you have ever heard “Why buy the whole pig when you can get the sausage for free?” philosophy from a woman?
Besides, it’s very silly to think men OR women get married for the sex. THAT’s much better outside the marriage! For a woman, anyway. Perhaps here, we get married for diffrent reasons. There’s lots of things that you can only get in a marriage, but sex certainly isn’t one of them.
I live in the US, and had a very fun social life before I got married, and sorry, just don’t see the picture you paint – poor little heartbroken women running over commitmentphobe guys, yelling, “marry me! marry me!”. Sorry. That’s just not the case. Every day thousands of couples get married, men propose, men get turned out just like everyone else. Every day I listen to my buddy friends sign and say, I wish I would meet a nice girl to marry.
@ella
My questions and my examples were raised for the American women who keep complaining about the Saudi men who dump them as if they don’t have any choice or role or responsibility…what you said is exactly what I wanted to say…it’s a mutual relationship…and even in some relationships with Saudis , the women get gifts and money, but that’s much better for a Saudi man than a long-life commitment.
What I’m saying is that when women make themselves cheap, they are treated in a very demeaning way. and I don’t mean by “cheap” anything related to money; I mean love, emothions, care, and sex. these things are very precious and shouldn’t be given to any prince charming just because he said a few sweet things to you. From a man’s perspective (any man), being easy means cheap, and so he gives himslf the right to dump you and treat you badly.
By the way, this seems a very Saudi concept, but I was amazed to read the same thing over and over in many books by American writers such as Dr. Phil, Greg Behrendt , and Sherry Argov.
When women fail to understand the nature of men (not just Saudi men), they fall into all sorts of disappointments.
@NN
I am trying to explain the situation from a man’s point of view. And if your men don’t marry for sex, our men do because they are not allowed to get it before marriage, and when they get it, they rarely get married.
Sex , love, care, compassion, settlement, sharing, and children are all reasons for marriage. and if some aren’t having great sex after marraige, this is not because of marriage. I know many people here in Saudi Arabia who have great sex lives with their partners (and we do talk about sex when we are close friends or relatives)
I know a couple who have been married for 30 years now and their sex life is great. If there is real love and understanding, the sex will be great……why am i talking about sex now? am i the only bad girl here?
you said…
just don’t see the picture you paint – poor little heartbroken women running over commitmentphobe guys, yelling, “marry me! marry me!”. Sorry. That’s just not the case. Every day thousands of couples get married, men propose, men get turned out just like everyone else. Every day I listen to my buddy friends sign and say, I wish I would meet a nice girl to marry.
I am not the one who said this…this is what other posts here implied…and this is what many American statistics are showing..and this is what many American programs and books are being best sellers for…
If it weren’t a problem, people wouldn’t be addressing in such a way.
That’s the #1 complaint of the American women I knew…we can’t get men to be committed to marraige…and it applies to Saudi and american men…maybe that’s not the majority, but that’s all I’ve been hearing from many American women and from this blog.
I truly don’t beleive that women are always victims who hold no responsibility. Women will always be victims as long as they victimize themsleves, and some women , unfortunatgely, like to play the role of the victim. and I am glad that this post and others here will help women get of this limited trivial scenario ( I gave him everything, but he left me!)
I really can’t understand why women fail to see their responsibilty in a relationship and I am trying to understand … maybe I am too old for all this dating and abandoning game cause I’ve been married for 17 years
Thanks
I think the thing here is that Saudi men and Western women are operating under two different sets of rules. It just so happens that under these rules the Western women get “screwed” (pardon the double entendre) because in their societies it is common for women to sleep with men before marriage, under Saudi culture it isnt common, certainly NOT with someone you plan on marrying.
In this day of the internet, as I think someone else has pointed out, there is NO excuse for ignorance. A quick google of Saudi men/Western women would let every women considering a relationship with a Saudi, run for the hills.
hey don’t knock them all
no offense but i don’t find them that different from say a few conservative indian men..or spanish men..or whatever .. there are chauvinistic jerks everywhere….
read about the culture if it’s diff than yours and If you keep your eyes open you can spot them , if not ask your mom i bet she can.
like someone said maybe i’m just too old for this dating scene, boy am i glad i was done a couple decades ago.. these days its’ like navigating a field full of land mines.
Maha
I think there is misunderstanding. Abu Sinan said it better – there are two different assumptions, way of looking at the relations, a western one and middle eastern one. In the west, sex with man before marriage does not mean that the woman is cheap. On the other hand sex with woman for Saudis and other ME men (and women who often look down on western woman) usually means that the woman is “spoiled goods”
I do understand why some western women complain, the behaviour of ME men is such that if he was a westerner she would be (nearly) certain that he wanted to marry her. And that is the reason for their complain. And even if one knows that the saudis (and other ME men) have different background and therefore think differently it is difficult to go out of your social milieu and think out of box when you are meeting a (seemingly) nice guy. Because, you see, it is one thing to understand the differences in behaviour intellectually, quite another one to understand them emotionally.
@ella
I think you misunderstood me, too. When I talked about women being cheap, I was talking about Saudi men’s perspective..that’s something every American woman puts into account…unless the Saudi man has been raised in America or by an American mother, he will always think of premarital sex as cheap..and some even think of themsleves as dirty and sinful for doing this and repent completely when they grow into their thirtis or before…
I think it’s just a matter of awareness on both sides…Americans and Saudis should be honest and clear about their expectations and perceptions of each other’s culture and values….if this honesty is missing, then the relationship is not going to last…
I totally agree with you on this “t is one thing to understand the differences in behaviour intellectually, quite another one to understand them emotionally.”
That last statment of yours brought to my mind one compliant of a Saudi relative who was married to an American woman…he used to compilan that they never enjoyed watching Egyptian comedies together becasue he had to explain lots of cultural backgrounds to her during their watch which spoiled his enjoyment…. This might seem very minor to some, but in my family having sense of humor and understanding it is a very important thing in a marriage or in any social gathering…personally I can’t imagine marrying a man who doesn’t understand/appreciate Adel Imam or Mohammad Sobhi sense of humor.
sorry…
I’ve been off topic again..I know
@Abu Sinan & ella
Sorry , i just saw Abu Sinan’s comment and surly expressed what I wanted to say in a better way.
Thanks
Aptly and succinctly, I can’t stand Saudi men since my infancy.
this is ridiculous i realy think Saudi man dont even know how to treat a woman if they do they have more right for them first of all .,.,.,.,
i am a non saudi woman, so i guess my opinion will not be counted, but i would like to share my story nevertheless.
i was once married to an arab man, an egyptian (does this apply?) to be exact. at first i thought he was charming and kind, but after a while, he turned out to be a nightmare.
he worked in jeddah and took me there to live with him only for three months. i questioned that decision but he insisted i would return to my country after the visa expired. i later found out he did that because he has another wife in egypt and he had to see his family after three months.
when it was the time for me to return,i got pregnant.he promised to move to my country before i give birth to our child but the child is seven years old now and he never fulfil his promise.during the marriage,we are separated now,he only visited me and the child once every two years.never give any financial help.never pay any alllowances except 2-3 times during eid.when i got pregnant again,he told me to abort my pregnancy.he was never there for those 2 births and did not cover a single cent for the second delivery.
during the marriage,he never live with me but made numerous sweet talks and promises that he would.initially i believed him,but after he asked me to abort my second pregnancy,i changed my perception.i realised he was a selfish,rude and heartless man who only think of himself.he said he would come but when the time arrived,he would ‘do things’ that change the plans.
he constantly made lies and promises that he never actually wanted to fulfil.whenever he visited me,i would be treated like a maid,be his driver even with broken toes i had to drive and follow him everywhere.he said he was my guest.i had to treat him like a guest. to me, he was my husband.but he could not see that.
later,i discovered he was looking for information to buy a house and looking for arab school, so he could take his ‘first’ family to live here.he never had any plans for us.i was just a stepping stone for him to achieve his goal – to relocate before he retired.
the marriage went down very fast after that.i had no desire to talk to him and slowly it all drifted away.i felt used and abused.i felt deeply hurt because i had dreams to build a happy family with him.but he has different plans.
i finally asked for a divorce when i realised the marriage would never work.i arranged a date where he would come and settle everything in court.
when the time was near, he did not come.he cursed and yelled at me and said he would not come.i decided it was enough.i would not talk to him anymore.
when the day of the hearing arrived,he dared to call and sms me asking about the divorce,whether it has already settled.how would it be settled when he was not there? what type of person who did that to another human being?after a while, he stopped calling when he realised i was serious. i do not want anything to do with him anymore.
and what i learned from all this…i notice that it is almost hereditery to sweet talk to people in their culture.it’s like a must,but it does not mean you have to fulfil it.sweet talk and more sweet talk.and it means nothing to them.promises and promises but they do not care if they carry that promises.
however,having to say that,good and not-so-good people do exist irrespective of race,culture and gender.it does not matter where we come from as long as we practice good deeds,behaviours and intentions.hopefully we will be treated similarly.
for those who treat people badly,the times will come for them to receive the same bad treatment in some stages of their life. God is indeed fair.
Dear Daffodils,
Thank you for your sharing of your experience. that is part of what this blog is all about.
Best Regards and wishes to you, Carol
Hi all!
I realize I’m posting a bit late compared to others, and I’m a non-Saudi woman, so I’m not sure my opinion counts or what not, but I just wanted to give a different perspective on this.
I’m one of those ‘Americans’ dating a Saudi. I must personally say that I don’t find him all that different, other than some basic cultural things, than dating an American male. Having grown up around a lot of cultures, I don’t feel I belong 100% to any of them.
As I learn more about Saudi culture, I can tell you that part of the reason I feel so comfortable around Saudi males is because the way I was raised is somewhere between what I have learned about most Arabic/ME cultures and stereotypical American culture, generally speaking. And to be honest, I don’t think the two are as different as most people like to think of them as being. In some ways, culture varies just as much from one state to another within the US (family life, what people do for fun, personal values, etc.). It just may not be as noticeable because the way people dress in public, laws, etc. are not as different. At the end of the day, people are still just people.
I decided to date my Saudi because he was very respectful about the way he asked me out. We had been friends for a while previously. I do not think he sees this as a casual thing, but if he does then that is his decision. I am not worried about becoming pregnant because I want children and don’t care if I’m a single mother. In the event I become one, I’ll just stay in countries where it makes it easy to be one. I am not concerned about the future because I have a loving family that I can rely on, and most importantly, I trust myself.
I am enjoying the time I spend with him now and that is what is important to me most of all. I haven’t felt this comfortable around any of the American (or other nationality) guys that I have dated in the past for various reasons. No one is promised tomorrow, so it is better IMO to enjoy the present (although having future plans and goals are important, too). I thought one of my previous relationships (with an American) would have lasted, but it didn’t and I was miserable most of the time I was in that relationship. So now, I’m just taking it day by day and trusting my intuition.
It’s not my Saudi’s ‘charm’, but rather who he is as an individual that I love. Yes, there are things that drive me crazy (annoy me) sometimes, but overall I’m quite happy. I realize the risk involved, but it’s worth it to me. If he decides to leave one day, then I am confident I can find plenty of other guys to date. At least I gave it a chance and was happy while it lasted. But maybe I just have an unusual outlook on life?
Just wanted to give a different perspective on this! Sorry if I’m posting in the wrong place…
@Strangeone,
Welcome and thanks for sharing your perspective. From what you have written it sounds like you have your eyes open. I’m glad that you also have a loving and supporting family.
If you are not aware, one thing I do wish to point out is that if you and your Saudi marry and have a child, the child would automatically be viewed as a Saudi by the Saudis. Even if you were not to marry and had a child, in the eyes of the Saudis he/she would be viewed as a Saudi. IF you were to go to Saudi Arabia with a child, then the husband is automatically viewed as the one with full custody. In too many marriages with foreigners in the event of a break up, the foreign (ex)wife ends up having to leave the Kingdom and without her children. It is up to the good grace of the former Saudi husband whether she gets to see or talk to her children.
As a non-Saudi woman married to a Saudi , I agree that the charm is only temporarily . I personally believe that Saudi men abroad try too hard to do all the right things to a woman and to be very charming. They know they have this bad reputation and they would do anything they can to prove it wrong. Once inside Saudi Arabia , these men are back to the way they truly are.
Strangeone,
I second American Bedu in what she said. Also, please be aware that Saudis view children born out wedlock very negatively. They consider it a huge scandal and in most cases they refuse to take any responsibility or play any part of their children lives. I’ve lived in Saudi Arabia for a long time and I’ve seen and heard many stories of Saudi men forcing their girlfriends to have abortions or simply disappearing when the girl refuses. No child deserves this. No child deserves to be considered a shame by his father.
Maybe you should discuss this matter with your boyfriend. Let him know of your intentions and get to know his.
Good Luck.
Thanks AmericanBedu and AnonymousCal for the input! I appreciate it!
Yes, I am aware of the Saudi laws as far as child custody, etc. (Special thanks to websites like this one! It’s given me plenty of insight into things that I should be aware of.) Based on what I know of the culture, it reminds me in some ways of what I’ve read/heard about how the US used to be in the early- to mid-20th century as far as pregnancies and having children out of wedlock are viewed, etc.
AnonymousCal, I agree wholeheartedly that I need to discuss this with my boyfriend, and hopefully soon. There are some other things I need to discuss with him as well, such as his plans for the future, what he expects from me, etc. I’ve heard from one of my friends that sometimes, the guy won’t explain his future plans to the girl, but rather will try to plan for both of them based on what he wants and what she has told him that she wants. If the girl wants to be aware of the guy’s future plans for both of them, she should make it clear to him that he needs to let her know. I have no idea if this applies to Saudi culture as well, but it seems to be this way based on some comments that he made either just prior to or immediately after officially asking me out (I don’t remember) about where we could live, what I could do for work if I wanted to, etc. Any thoughts on this?
Thanks once again to all the people who post on this site! It really helps me a lot to gain a better understanding of different views, cultural issues and values, etc.
@Anon Cal,
Thanks for sharing your view and giving some additional guidance to Strangeone based on your experiences and observations.
Strangeone,
It is a very unusual and unique Saudi who will decide to remain and live outside of KSA on behalf of a foreign wife and children. Most will have a strong urge to return home to the extended family but especially to be close to their Mom. I know of some Saudis who have been in their 50′s and after more than 20 years outside decided it was time to move back home.
Some Saudi men will wish to have all plans in place and “do it all” themselves believing that they are making the right decisions and therefore no need to consult with a woman. Other Saudi men may not want to lose their foreign wife/girlfriend and therefore prefer to shield her from challenges (marriage approvals/existing wives/family not approving) by not saying anything.
If it were simpler, my advice to a woman thinking of marrying a Saudi is to first go and work for a while in the Kingdom towards determining if this is a culture to which she can adapt and be happy.
American Bedu,
From what I can tell, I have a strong feeling that he will want to return home at some point because he misses it and his family, especially his mom. That is one of the reasons why it is so important to me that I learn as much as I can about the culture. If I were to eventually move there (which is likely if I stay with him), I know that it will be difficult for me to adjust (especially at the beginning), but as my mom puts it, there are good and bad things about every place that you will live. The thing is to focus on the good things to love about a particular place rather than the bad. I think for now, though, he is okay with living abroad.
One again, thanks for the advice!
@strangeone,
I suggest reading the various Saudi blogs (check my blogroll and links). It would also be helpful to read the Saudi newspapers too. Be as informed as you can. Learn about the area he is from too.
Good luck Carol
Strangeon,
I would say that 99% of Saudi men with western girlfriends don’t think of marriage, they are just looking for a company (and a bit of sexual experience!) while they are away from home. Most of them will deliberately hide this from the girlfriends in fear of losing them. I think you shouldn’t waste your time planning ahead anything until you discuss this issue with him. Be frank and direct. He might be sharing some of his future plans with you, but are you sure his plans include you ?
Regarding the move to Saudi Arabia, I would advise you of making a visit here first before making any decision. It is an advise I wish someone gave me 18 years ago ! . This will give you not only the chance of experiencing life and culture here firsthand, but it will also give you a rare chance of knowing your Saudi man for the person he truly is. You have no idea how much a Saudi man changes once he is in his country. I’ve been living here for more than 16 years, I met tons of western women married to Saudi men and if we all have something in common, it would be that we all agree that our men now are so different here than when we met them the west, we all agree that sometimes we ask ourselves in disbelief ” Is this the guy I fell in love with ? ” . I know that I asked myself this question shortly after moving to Saudi Arabia, and I still do.
Also, please bear in mind that in Saudi Arabia, as a woman you basically have no rights, you will be fully depending on your husband. You will need his permission (and I mean legal permission) every time you want to travel outside the country, or when you get a new job, your future daughters will need their father’s permission to enroll in college no matter how old they are. There is no law to protect you or your children from domestic violence behaviors. In case of a divorce, you won’t get anything at all and you will lose your children.
This is no anti-Saudi propaganda, this is the reality of women in Saudi Arabia .
AnonymousCal,
Thank you for your input. I understand that you are very concerned about my situation, and I just want to say that I really appreciate you trying to help others from making a huge mistake.
I agree that a lot of Saudi men don’t consider marriage to a foreigner for different reasons. Some of them date women for sex while others I have met don’t really date around. It depends on their personal beliefs and desires.
My boyfriend isn’t the only Saudi male I know. I met a lot of them before I started dating my boyfriend, and there were a few (including my boyfriend) that I knew rather well just as friends. I was dating someone else at the time, and they knew I wasn’t going to cheat. I think they really respected me for this because I was getting asked out quite a bit more than I ever have in the past.
These friends treated me with nothing but respect. If I needed something, they were there to help. One tried to flirt with me, but he flirts with everyone (much like one of my American friends- I think they could almost be twins…haha). Still, they really do care about their friends. That said, my boyfriend is a bit more open-minded than the others (a thought confirmed by one of my non-Saudi friends) and I believe he is including me in future plans.
However, like any other relationship, it can only progress so fast. People in general come with different baggage, so it can take time for someone to open up completely with another person. This is especially true when people are used to being independent and more private about their personal life. I know I have a hard time opening up about certain things myself. Still, my boyfriend tries to answer any questions I have about himself, his family, etc. He makes a point to talk with me every day and to plan things to do together. Sounds like a relatively normal relationship to me. I am aware things would be different in Saudi Arabia because of the culture. But then, if he hadn’t have come here, I would never have met him in the first place.
Thank you for the advice about coming to visit before making a final decision. I have already mentioned to my boyfriend that when he is comfortable with our relationship, I’d like to visit his city and his family, but that I am also aware of what that would mean to his family so not until he is/we are ready for it. I would not marry him without at least meeting his family first.
It’s been very difficult for me, personally, to find a guy that I can be happy with. I have a very odd perspective on life that has been shaped through different (though somewhat unusual) experiences. I have seen a lot of different ways of living. I have seen people make really bad life decisions and later make really good life decisions. There will be cultural differences I will have to deal with whether I date an American, a Saudi, etc. When it comes to family life, I find I have more in common with my current boyfriend than most of my ex-boyfriends (who are American, mostly).
I am aware of the laws you mention. In the event that my boyfriend and I get married, I trust him. There will be things I’d want to discuss with him of course, but that goes for any guy who wanted to marry me. And of course, it’s a bit more important because of the laws there.
AnonymousCal,
I am somewhat curious what your experiences have been in Saudi Arabia. Are you happy? What has been really difficult for you since you moved there? Do you regret marrying your Saudi man and/or moving to Saudi Arabia? If this is too personal for you to discuss, I understand and apologize for asking.
Oh, and just to clarify, my recent ex-boyfriend broke up with me before my current Saudi boyfriend asked me out (in a very respectful manner, might I add).
@Strangeone,
I just wanted to comment that if you are able to visit Saudi prior to marriage, it would likely be for work. Anyone traveling to Saudi Arabia must have a sponsor.
Good luck. If he is meant to be the one for you, I sincerely wish you all the best and all happiness. I do not want to discourage anyone from pursuing love and happiness. However in spite of having married a Saudi myself, I would not strongly encourage pursuit of the relationship unless many questions have been answered.
REAL STORY
Hi! this is the first time I visit this website and I have to say that I really apreciate this discussion! I am from Brazil, and last summer I went study english on Canada, where I made a lot of friends around the world. The thing is… I FELL IN LOVE WITH A SAUDI GUY! Omg, I did not know what to do… We spend like 1 month toguether, totaly fall in love… I think in the begginning was a little scary, we didnt know if it would be wrong or not… Now, I came back to Brazil and he to Saudi Arabia, but we still in contact and in love… We talk everyday and he is making plans to visit brazil next year… It really seems like a summer love, but I think it may became something elese… And I am so afraid! I think I will spend much time in this website… thank u for share your experiences… You can write me too! I need hear someone else opinion! thank u! byebye
Welcome non-Saudi girl! I do encourage you to read many of the earlier posts and particularly those categorized under relationships.
It’s a pleasure to have you hear at the blog.