Sad but true, no matter how long a Saudi and his foreign wife are married, she will always be viewed to a degree as an “outsider” and not included or accepted the same as a Saudi wife. The family will likely treat her politely but never with the same sense of belonging. She will be expected to be more independent. While the females of the Saudi family will be protected and coddled and not have to worry about having their needs met, the foreign wife will be expected to take care of herself, likely find her own transport and be responsible for her needs.
It goes without saying that a foreign wife and particularly Western wife of a Saudi in Saudi Arabia will need a thick skin. Hopefully she will have a supporting husband who will stick up for her and watch out for her particularly in regards to familial pressures. But at the same time, the Saudi man will usually defer to his mother’s wishes and desires even if they happen to be against the interests of the foreign wife.
Saudi families not only expect the foreign wife to take care of herself but to be there for any family issues, problems or support. She must be careful so she is not viewed and used as a substitute for the housemaid. It is a double-edged sword. On one hand the foreign wife will want to show her love to her new Saudi family and reach out to them whether it will be serving them tea or bringing them special dishes but it is a fine line where it goes from the foreign wife showing her love to the Saudi family expecting her to take care of all details and messes.
I do not want to imply that this is the case in every marriage between a Saudi man and a Western wife but based on findings, it does seem to by the most typical.
Filed under: America, culture, gender, relationships, Saudi Arabia, Saudi culture, Saudi customs, travel, Uncategorized, Women Issues Tagged: | culture, customs, gender, gender issues, KSA, Love, marriage, Relationship, romance, Saudi Arabia, Saudi culture, Saudi customs, women
I don’t doubt that all of this is true. It’s one of the intuitions I had when considering marriage to a wonderful Saudi man.
However, I do believe that the status of “outsider” is mitagated to the extent that the she learns Arabic. I don’t mean the elementary, communicative language that gets you by in the suq or a polite gatherng. I mean near-native fluency in Arabic.
If this is an unrealistic expectation, then perhaps it is also unrealistic to expect that the “outsider” ever makes a place for herself except on the periphery of her husband’s family.
Marahm,
Based on my observations, whether she speaks arabic fluently or not does not matter. I know women who have been in KSA for 20 plus years married to a Saudi who still feel like an outsider in regards to the extended Saudi family. It does not seem to matter how long or short she’s been married or in the Kingdom. It is just a fact one needs to also take into consideration when marrying a Saudi and coming to KSA.
I agree with you, Bedu…I am not married, but I have lots of experience with life in Saudi Arabia and I have certainly observed what you described…”thick skin” is definitely a must.
-theHalf Breed
btw…I love your blog! I’ll be following it now…please check mine out, too!
http://beliefcan.blogspot.com
atleast the foreign wife has a person to lean i.e., saudi husband – he is the ultimate who can make the pressure to pleasure, lest the life of wife would be miserable
is there any example of that side too? (becoming life miserable)
that brings up another good point in that yes, the foreign wife does lean heavily on the husband as he is typically her sole or primarily support line. Prior to the Kingdom a Saudi man may indicate he will be supportive and the wife has nothing to worry about but in reality the man may not be aware of either just how much his wife will need his support in so many ways or how much pressure he may also receive from his extended family which pull him in many directions.
I do not understand the second part of your question srinivas…you want examples of miserable wives?
I think it depends on the KSA family the Western wife marries into. Also, you have to remember that KSA is a closed society with strict norms and values. You can write a PHD thesis on KSA cultural etiquette’s. My suggestion would be don’t try to hard. Interracial marriage in KSA is actually very new in comparison to USA. It’s not accepted culturally and legally difficult requiring special permits with prior approval.
Or it could be that KSA ladies feel threatened and a scene of priority over western women. Who cares, find good friends and stick with them.
yes, miserable life of foreign wife
after bringing the foreign wife to KSA, if husband lean towards family pressure, the life of foreign wife would be miserable
do any instance of such has happened? if so, you can write an article on that too
sorry! i may be dragging you too far – but your articles are very much informative and thought provoking.
Well, I must say that being in the family has had its ups and downs. I’ve always been treated well, except by my American sister in laws! They’re even from the same town….you’d think we would have bonded right away. Anyway, living as a foreign wife has its perks. If we survive the first few years, we get the best of both worlds. And our husband can be as protective as we let him…..we just need to let him help us and not be so darn independent all the time. I think Saudi men like our independence, but not to the point that we don’t need him at all. That is the fault of us Americans….we try to do it all, be it all, and not complain. I’m happy here in KSA and in the USA. Al hum du li lah!
The not belonging thing has always irked me. In my 20 years married into his family…I never felt like I belonged…and they made sure I was never mistaken on that point. Which is ironic really because other families I was not married into treated me like a daughter…sister etc…and never for a moment made me feel like an outsider…my own natural reserve did that to me but not them.
The whole “western women are expected to take care of themselves” rings a bell for me. I learned that when a Bahraini women (and this is true for many Arabs I believe) has a baby…its quite commong practice for her to go home to mommy and lay in bed for 40 days while mommy and sisters and housemaid takes care of her and the new baby. She doesnt have to do a thing. I thought that was pretty nice thing considering how exhausted and demanding a new baby can be…and I helped my neices in laws with their new babies right along with everyone else….so imagine my surprise and hurt when my babies came along…and…nothing. They never once came to my room to ask about me…never brought me lunch or did little things for me. When I asked my (then) husband why they werent doing the same for me they did for each other (and I did as well)…his reply was that because I was American…Im much “tougher” and didnt need that sort of attention that Bahraini ladies need…uhm…really? Thanks for nothing….sigh!
coolred38, They go home to mommy, so your supposed to go home to your mommy not his mommy. Anyway, I would not trust the care of my new baby to anyone else, but that’s just me.
Well, you can find the same situation in all Arab countries. They usually treat the foreigner with “different” standard than they do with their own skin. In my opinion, that’s referred to the tribal traditions and closed family relationships where any foreigner, whether Arab or Western, should earn their respect and prove that they are eligible to be part of this family, no matter how many years does this take.
Abdullah
My husband’s family comes from a well-respected tribe that is considered open-minded. They have always made me feel a part of the family masha’Allah alhamdulillah.
Does anyone think the less tribal Saudis are, the more accepting they are of a foreigner joining their family?
thanks for sharing views miriam and coolred – one should be bold to face any eventuality – love the family – be one among the family – accept their tradition – never be rigid to ones stand
here religion comes to rescue – all religious texts tells to love everybody – dont expect anything, returns would come automatically
@ islamicarticles, what is respected tribe? what is tribal? do you mean cultured?
i had read a blog wherein that lady had to suffer a lot – initially, she started blogging thinking that the problem would resolved but to her dismay it got worsened
@ Sultan- “Who cares, find good friends and stick with them.”
Well most people do care, understand that most foriegn wives give up their families even when they are very close to them. They are miles apart from their own family, in a different land, surrounded by a different culture, and seeking some kind of sense of belonging in extended family becuase it is the normal thing to do. Everyone wants to belong in some way, wants to be accepted by others especially family and seeks to be embrassed. It is human nature afterall and it hurts when these human desires can’t be fulfilled with ‘family’.
I think any foreign wife married to a Saudi will have some ups and downs. And I’ll include myself in that equation. However as pointed out by several commentors, the key is just to adapt. Have your good friends, get a tougher skin and while do not be afraid to stand up for yourself, do choose your battles carefully.
“coolred38, They go home to mommy, so your supposed to go home to your mommy not his mommy…”
Oh…is that how it works. So explain to me how I might have done that considering my husband would not allow me to leave the country with HIS child…as do a great many Arab husbands of foreign wives.
When you bring home a foreign wife you should make it clear to your family that the foreign wife is here to stay…make her feel at home…do for her what you do for each other…in other words…”want for your brother/sister what you want for yourself”…some families (talking mother and sister in laws in particular) just dont seem to get that.
btw…of course I took care of my own babies…but a little extended hand in help is never refused in times of weakness and exhaustion…funny how you turned that around to sound like neglect or laziness…sheesh!!!
Carol- and can I say get a hobby gals for those of you who don’t work. Something, anything that brings about pleasure for yourself. I think that helps a great deal in keeping a balance in your life here. There is loads to do if you seek it out
If your gonna take the plunge and you love a Saudi man. … Especially if your a woman who has enjoyed complete freedom in all areas of her natural existence. …You should arrange to live there for a year or so, meet family, expereince the culture, then shift back to the free open world, well, honestly I say the real world. Who in their right mind especially an american woman can put up with possibly being described or thought of or treated even if its 1% of the time as the house maid??? I wouldnt be able to stay indoors, not drive, housework all day, wear the black abaya, and conform to all the religous protocol???, it isnt fair to think that is a reality for like—the rest of your life!!!
.
Sultan, get a sex-change operation, give birth to a baby, go through all the pain and exhaustion, and then see (if you’re still alive) how you will like it to be the only one left on your own with a 24 hour per day needy baby and having to do it all alone. It’s barbaric treatment which-ever way you look at it.
(except yours apparently)
And now I see how this happens; apparently all saudi/arab blokes can cheerfully block out any problems, hurt feelings, loneliness, heartache, lost family, broken hearts, homesickness, unfair treatment, culture shock, depression, etc. And even turn it around and be able to blame the uprooted wife for it.
Thank you for giving us an insight into such a despicable mindset.
Everytime a Saudi/arab man replies on this blog, I feel horrified at the mindset…..
this treatment is not only prevalent at one part of world. at India, majority of girls who marry against the wishes of parents (either boy or girl) had to face this wrath. parents think (hope am not like that
} their sibling is going out of their hand – this notion is wrong. the religious leaders interpret the religious texts wrongly for their selfish gain and give barbaric treatment on the young minds.
i always dream to have boundary less world – hope for citizens of world – seek brotherly sisterly feeling all over the world
my today’s prayer with the almighty for this dream
I think feeling like an outsider can apply to all cultures regarding in-laws. There’s a “freeze factor” sometimes on both sides to a degree – husbands fam and wife’s fam.
Agreeing that particularly in a culture, country other than one’s own there’s bound to be some adaptability issues, which can be and are put to ease by the relationship the husband and wife have for each other.
Whether it remains happy or miserable really depends on the couples ability and willingness to communicate openly – and yes, not harshly – with each other. Doesn’t it? Tho sometimes words between couples can get strained… you step back, cool off, sort it out, but still communicate and resolve it – maybe.
It’s understood that family life may be a bit different there, but still it’s family life … like here or anywhere else, some things don’t change. Those things that don’t change become the bridges.
I guess you just develop the relationship, they too have to develop a relationship with you. Each is “earning” to the other.
Yeah, but what do I know!
I was pretty much alone with my daughter. My then husband was afraid to hold her until my mother sat him down in a chair and put her in his arms.
When my mother-in-law did watch her, twice, the second time my daughter cried and cried and cried, she was about 3 months old then, and we had gone out to dinner for the first time in a long time. After that even my ex said, no one else watches her.
idk, I wouldn’t trade that for anything. I don’t see it as a sacrifice, I didn’t give up my freedom, I embraced my life as a mother. It was difficult sometimes, not too long after birth, she got her days and nights mixed up, it took a little time and hardly any sleep to move her back on schedule, but it worked out. I remember walking with her around the apartment singing, it would lull her to sleep.
Idk, I think those times you spend with your children, exploring the wonders of life – for a second time – as it opens to them brand new, is wonderful.
Knowing that I was there for every one of them … priceless! ;>
these are nice insights, would you say that non-westerner wifes would assimilate easily.
While I do not disagree that their can be inlaw and extended family challenges in any relationship, it is perhaps felt more strongly in Saudi by a foreign wife as she probably does not have her own familial support network in place. And this is what the Saudi husband may need time to understand and might not have been fully prepared on how the lack of “blood” family for the wife in turn makes her more reliant on him whereas in the typical Saudi culture, the wife can readily lean on her family for transport, for moral support, etc.
In praise of Saudi men commenting on this blog–I find all the comments enlightening and many of them especially so; also, this is a very important perspective to have whether one always agrees or not, and relatively rare here.
am asking just for curiosity
why black pencil alone is facing other six colours (are these seven indicator of vibgyor)?
There’s a saying that blood is the family you’re born with, friends are the family you choose.
And there are times, knowing that Allah places you with the blood family you have, ya kinda wonder what the heck He was thinking!
You get together for family outings / events you know someone is eventually going to say “What’s that supposed to mean?”
Ah sheezh, here it goes!
@ Laura- There are many women who choose to live in Saudi. Not by threat, not by being a hostage but by full free choice.. like me. Are inlaws an issue? I believe they are for most people. Will some women be seen as the ones who should clean up? Happens in many cultures, even working women in the US are expected to take care of household chores as well as work. Not driving isn’t a major issue as one can easily get out and about. There are many people in the world that don’t drive.. are they doomed? The abya isn’t a hinderance.. the mindset of others is. And I don’t do housework all day.. I did more housework in the US than I’ve ever done here. Call me crazy.. but crazy I’ll be there are pros and cons to any living condition.. to choose to see only the negative of one culture isn’t the best way to view the world.
btw I do have the good and the bad amongst my inlaws. But my American ex sister in law was a royal B and I would take any of my Saudi inlaws over that one.
@ Nzingha
There are many people in the world that don’t drive..
is knowledge driving a must? i dont know driving – am scared to drive even a two wheeler
“She must be careful so she is not viewed and used as a substitute for the housemaid. It is a double-edged sword.”
I have seen this happen. It’s truly sad that a foreign woman has to be placed under circumstances like these. I guess it’s something you have to put up with. Someone told me think of it as a test in your marriage. Sometimes you’ll succeed, others don’t…
I’m not even married and I already feel this “outsider” feeling, by just being half American, half Arab… getting treated differently than other girls I know who are full Arab.
I must say though, I’ve learned how to cope with it by using one side as an advantage over the other, haha….
Btw… the inlaw thing, totally normal in most cases of Arab’s marrying foreign wives. Nothing new. Your super lucky if you have that mother-in-law who actually appreciates that your different.
This is very very very true! No matter what you do, you will always be seen as the outsider on a certain level (even when u are half Saudi! lol). At times I feel like I am part of the family, and the very next second, I feel I am treated like an alien that just came off a spaceship! The worst part is, they don’t even realise they are doing it!
Dear A.B.,
One of your readers made an excellent point in passing. I do believe this is AGAIN a sympton of tribal culture. And I agree with the suggestion made that non-tribal families are more inclusive. My basis for that is simply observation of my friends in the western region (hijazi) who welcome people most readily into their families through marriage.
Your readers should be aware that this feeling of “unwelcome” is not restricted to only western wives. I pity the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th wives of various often arab descent, who are not saudi. They do try to find each other, as do western wives. And I might add, that they often share a religion and language with their husband’s family AND it is still not “enough” to be included.
Carol and the other wonderful western ladies who contribute to this blog, as a saudi and muslim, I apologize and am deeply ashamed that we who supposedly take great pride in our hospitality, have hurt or offended you.
My problem was never my in laws- it was the uncles and aunts of my husband’s family that to this day can give us grief… Recently an uncle (married to a half sister of MIL) asked when my husband was going to get a real Yemeni wife!
Got to give credit where its due- my father in law whipped out his jambiah (Yemeni dagger) and shouted for the man to leave the house as his very presence was an insult.
My FIL had recently arrived for an extended visit- so of course everyone State side want to come and pay their respects- the incident put a damper on his visit and solemnly agreed with why my husband keeps away from his own people…
We have grown children together- and to some not even that is enough for a “true” marriage- whatever that definition may be…
And if you are wondering about the Jambiah and how it got to the States- we brought a few before 911- all dull bladed of course- though the kitana and the machetes (courtesy of my son) are nicely sharpened- hmmm… something to keep handy if I have another of those unfortunate encounters…
“The worst part is, they don’t even realise they are doing it!…”
For me the worst part was… that they did realize they were doing it…and that seemed fine with them.
And dont get me started on the half Arab half something else…you are always ALWAYS treated like the something else…never the Arab…especially if the something else comes from your mothers side….sigh!
Mariam…unless your guilty of such behavoir…why apologize? but its nice all the same (smiles).
Great post and interesting comments! Some thoughts
While in all marriages each spouse must make it clear to his or her own family that the new spouse is to be respected, this is probably even more true of mixed marriages, and even more so when the foreign spouse (wife) is reliant on the husband’s family by culture (tradition of the wife joining the husband’s family) and geography–where the wife has neither family nor a long established group of friends readily available for support, socializing, etc.
This is probably even more true in Saudi than other places because of the need for a mahrem and the restriction on establishing male-female friendships (narrowing the circle of possible friends).
The independance-dependance-interdependance balance in a marital relationship is challenged by immigration to one spouse’s country, and with added restrictions in Saudi must be even more challenged, putting a strain on both partners. The assumption of independance on the part of the foreign wife can be difficult, but it is true, at least in my experience, that the foreign wife often unwittingly curtails the offers of help.
Language acquisition wherever one is foreign is desirable for better integration with family (even if some families or some members of a family enjoy their linguistic dominance), and adaptation generally–the ability to participate more fully in social life, the workplace, the activities in the country, and to better understand the culture.
The cross-cultural marriage research I have read emphasizes the importance of knowledge of each other’s language and culture, visiting each other’s home countries and families prior to marriage (admittedly harder in the case of Saudi), and specifically of the Western spouse in an Arab country having a job or career (or compelling hobby as Nzingha says) to keep an area of competence and independance outside of the sometimes overwhelming (to the Westerner) demands and togetherness of Arab families.
Individual family members may be more or less difficult because of personality, beliefs, position in the family, or particular issues with the foreign spouse. This is where the husband’s position in the family and clear support of his wife is paramount. Siding with his mother is culturally understandable (if difficult) whereas siding with other family members is less so. Hopefully, happy compromises rather than unhappy sacrifices become the norm.
As usual, American Bedu’s advice about adapting, getting a tougher skin (generally needed to survive cultural differences in acceptable joking, teasing, “intrusiveness”, and sometimes specifically needed for family), having friends, and sticking up for oneself in wisely chosen battles is excellent.
Mariam–great comment as usual, and a gracious cultural apology.
Inal–in my experience this is one of the cultural adaptations for Westerners–all these family members to the nth degree, and nth generation, as well as the inlaws of the inlaws ARE the “inlaws”, not just the nuclear family of origin as we might think. Nice FIL defence though
There have been times when I have thought a nicely sharpened knife-like instrument, or at least a nicely sharpened verbal comeback would be helpful. 
I forgot to add above that my understanding from Arab men friends is that the “turn the foreign wife into a housemaid strategy” is one designed primarily to end the marriage, and secondarily to take advantage of the newcomer’s inability to stick up for herself, or willingness to try to get along.
I think feeling like an outsider can apply to all cultures regarding in-laws. There’s a “freeze factor” sometimes on both sides to a degree – husbands fam and wife’s fam.
Agreeing that particularly in a culture, country other than one’s own there’s bound to be some adaptability issues, which can be and are put to ease by the relationship the husband and wife have for each other
I don’t know if I’m even allowed to comment here, since this is not my deal but…the various issues that a western women has to put up with when she marries an Arab/Saudi…does not apply to all cultures in regards to in-laws, and the so-called outsider. My husband’s family is Swedish (he was born and raised in Sweden), and I’m a Black American (born and raised in San Diego). I met my husband while he was in the states going to school. When I moved with him to Sweden…I was welcomed into his family, I was NEVER treated as an outsider, the fact that I was Black, American, and could not speak Swedish was never an issue. My family welcomed my husband with open arms. When birthdays come around…he gets congrats just like everyone else. I think this freeze factor you mention boils down to a lack of sensitivity and compassion on the part of the Saudi/Arab man’s family. Any family who can’t sympathize with the fact that this woman is in a foreign country, without her family, and is probably a little fearful, is kinda deliberatly cruel considering that the family plays a big part in Saudi/Arab culture.
From what I’m reading here, it is enough to make any woman considering marrying a Saudi/Arab man run for the hills.
Laura, there are some really great saudi guys commenting here, actually trolls are almost non-existant.
srinivas, once you have driven a car for a while the world will never be the same…
Mariam, I’m sure anybody from anywhere in the world will be lucky to have you as a SIL!!!
Inal, I hope I will remember, if we ever get to meet, to be really polite….
And ”growing a tougher skin” doesn’t come naturally, I think it’s more the resulting effect of going through a lot of insults neglect and pain.
And don’t come with this ”culture”-crap; we are all human beings, we feel the same, we hurt the same. Unless the Saudies are só inbred that their IQ has collectively dropped to 34, all these in-laws know exactely what they are about!!!!
Sorry getting really upset when contemplating how some of my friends have been in pain.
Wish I could take out my sword (sharpened) and chop somebody up….
I think a lot of it has to do with the degree of comfort and probably familiarity that particular families have with people from another country/culture. If your only experience is of a particular way of living, then someone that represents a different way of living can be very discombobulating, almost threatening. I do not mean that this excuses mean or disrespectful behavior towards a newcomer but it may explain why people who would otherwise be welcoming are reluctant to stretch out their hand. Even in Ireland, where we are almost notoriously friendly, it may take a while for a stranger to be admitted to the inner circle of family – the pub is one thing but that magic inner circle is quite another.
As an example of what I mean – a relative of an in-law of mine (see we have tribes in Ireland too), married a guy from the Netherlands. Now the family involved are the nicest, most welcoming family one could encounter – genuine, friendly, all the good stuff – but they live in a remote part of the country and had never met a Dutchman before. According to my in-law, the family treated this guy as if he were from outer space – he became known as the Man from Mars, much to his own amusement and delight, I should say.
Aafke …
then they say we Americans are barbarians… LOL
But the matter is that regardless how far apart culturally, ethnically, geographically you may be from your spouse’s family -nothing excuses the insults, veiled and unveiled; nor the lack of compassion for a fellow human being trying to fit into the puzzle that is family life.
Chiara, what ever the definition of in law may be; that man not of my husband’s blood is an uncouth, boar not fit to be called family in My Family… or as one of my Ya-Ya friends would say in her most dramatic voice- “Rend your cloth, for he is dead to you”.
His snarky comment was meant to hurt – “discard the old woman, get a new one and start all over.”.. My husband and my son are still fuming over the incident because it happened in our home… and I will be honest to say that if we had stayed in Yemen all these years, the “nth inlaws” would have ruined our marriage long ago… there is but so much a person can take…
I really hope people read your comments before they set themselves up for unrealistic expectations. This is not a judgment call. People must realize that they are marring into a culture where women don’t have the same right’s. So I guess love is blind..lol
Inal–absolutely agreed, the man was/is a boor, or burbero as my grandmother would say; and no degree of relatedness would justify his knowingly vicious comment, which is why I once again applaud your FIL, a man who knows his paternal responsibilities and exercises them. The nths know the culture better than we do which allows them to be all the more knowingly vicious when they choose. The culture and the relatedness in this situation are not explanations but self-styled “excuses for abuse” which need to be dealt with as such, whether by the point of a Jambiah, pistols at dawn, shunning, or “the geographical solution” of taking hubby and kids far far away.
Putting it that way it sounds medieval doesn’t? But then Yemen is a whole ‘nother ball o’ wax…
Indeed–but then the Middle Ages (5th to the 15th centuries) weren’t all bad. Though admittedly rather “Dark” early on, they included the Islamic Golden Age in Al-Andalus, and prepared the way for the Renaissance. I used to fancy myself a lady in a Medieval castle embroidering tapestries, playing the lute, and ready courtly romances, until I calculated that given my non-aristocratic origins I was more likely to have died in a mud hut in childbirth at the ripe old age of thirty, or at best been the happy homemaker of a successful guildsman.
No judgement here. This is simply my observation but I find it interesting no one seems to have posted an observation from the in-law’s point of view.
You are an outsider. It is a fact. So why is it so weird to be treated like one? They probably don’t know your culture, how to interact, what are the rules, have to teach you arabic, how to behave, it could be very confusing. I’m uncertain why clearly an outsider would expect to be treated with complete inclusiveness. It would be incredibly extra nice if it was to happen but why the ‘expectation’ of it?
Now after many, many years if it continues for all that time that would be very strange but if they are raised in a culture that gives them specific guidance to behave this way or leaves them with no guidance on how to handle the situation really this seems a bit predictable.
Really I’m simply trying to point out that perhaps from there side its just as confusing to them. Maybe the outsider should tell them how to relate to them?
Really it seems a confusing situation so the results should be confusion.
An excellent point. Maybe some of the Saudi commentors will describe the joys and challenges of welcoming, and helping foreign wives to acculturate.
My own experience of welcoming Arabs or others and helping them to acculturate to Canada is that it is fun and rewarding, but at times frustrating and annoying. Although I have a very high tolerance for criticism of my country and homesickness, at some point sometimes I even feel like saying “well perhaps you would be happier living in your own/another country”. Also, sometimes despite one’s best efforts, the other person may choose to persist in a pattern of behaviour that is garanteed to give a negative impression or have a negative result. And sometimes it is important to point out that all of us are held to certain codes of behaviour, not just foreigners. Eg. no Canadian with a BA in Economics is particularly employable in a poor economy, not just a foreign student (who may in fact have language skills and cultural knowledge that gives an advantage); all men applying to med school are advised to shave their facial hair for the interview, unless it is a religious obligation (not choice) to keep it, etc.
Mariam ~ May Allah bless your gracious heart.
I have very much enjoyed catching up and reading all the great comments!!! Thank you everyone!
San Diego Reader – I think what really surprised me was in comparing at least my family’s attitude towards someone who is not related to the family and the Saudi perspective. Thankfully I was raised in an environment that we were meant to make anyone (guest, family, extended family, in-law) to feel comfortable and welcomed. If someone did not speak the language, it was our duty and expectation of my parents/grandparents to ensure that person never felt left out. (I come from a multi-cultural family) Then one will here so much about the Saudi hospitality (which can indeed be very beautiful) and feel surprised to see that while initial gestures of hospitality are always given, they stop at a certain point as if “duty completed now can carry on….”
Again, thanks to everyone for the excellent comments.
American Bedu–I really appreciate your comment which highlights the difference between hospitality toward a guest, and helping someone acculturate and integrate into the family. The first is easier and more obvious, while the second is less clear and more complicated. Most people are good at hospitality whereas acculturation takes time, is uneven, and is less charted territory. Actually integrating into a family invokes all sorts of family dynamics, individual, social and cross-cultural. Most people who have only experienced wonderful Arab hospitality are surprised by and lack understanding of the more challenging acculturation and integration into a family.
srinivas, on January 26th, 2009 at 11:01 am Said: what is respected tribe? what is tribal? do you mean cultured?
@ srinivas- my husband claims his tribe is well-respected not me lol. Tribe as in those groups in society that are organized based upon kinship. For example some tribes in Saudi are named Al-Ruwaidi, Al-Qahtani, Al-Dossary, etc. My husband told me there are even sub-tribes…whew!
Irisheyesksa, One can’t do better, interculturally speaking, than marry into the Dutch!!!!
Sultan, sorry, I think that’s a rubbish answer.
If you read coolred’s comment again you will notice that all women in her family got pampered and coddled after giving birth, coolred doing her bit for the family as much as anybody, and when it was her turn, when she had had a very difficult birth, she was singled out, left completely on her own, no pampering no care, not even some basic support.
So don’t try to get out with your ”expect women are treated different” crap!!!!
Chiara – you’re welcome!
Srinivas, islamicarticles – One could write posts and posts about tribes. I did do some earlier posts on the importance of tribes but perhaps it’s time for me to do another and more detailed one.
Aafke – as always, love your comments!
American Bedu- That would be a posting I’d look forward to. I even read that the shabab have developed numbers to identify their tribe!
wonderful articles and healthy comments
am really enjoying and also getting insight of unknown world – never expected that women at muslim countries can express so freely
one small request from my side – can the font size be increased? with spectacles, am finding slightly difficult to read – if not possible, i have no problem
for your information, since one week, my roaming amongst blogs has totally changed – 5 years back, i was one of the person who started blogging in my local language and addicted only to that language – now am roaming at middle east blogs
– our people are grumbling that am not replying to their writings 
thanks to shahrzad, americanbedu, americanarab (to name a few) who have tied me here
Srinivas, I’m not a very good techie but I am using the recommended font size for word press but as I understand you can easily increase the font size on your computer. I believe you simply click view and choose either zoom or text size!
Glad to learn you have a new perspective of blogging and pleased to have you here at American Bedu
please stop bashing men. You people have issues with your own spouse to deal with. Colored38 get some help for your anger, talk to your abusive husband. Stop whining.
John,
I think you are jumping quick here… Individuals are simply sharing what experiences they have had to either gain some advice or perhaps sensitize others on characteristics to be watchful for. I don’t think one should be too quick to judge coolred and/or what she has been through.
John…I say this with the utmost respect…
BITE ME!!!
looking for American lady to marry her in Saudi Arabia
Hi Carol,
I am still following your website from time to time….And everytime, I found your website covered much more interesting topics …and definately enrich my knowledge about Saudi and Saudi people….keep it up!
Sharing insights about the challenges, and joys of mixed marriages, along with helpful hints would seem to me to benefit both men and women, husbands and wives, who presumably had some positive reason to marry in the first place.
Another excellent – but short post American Bedu. Whilst reading your post, I think that this sort of jealousy between wife and mother-in-law (kinee) is prevalent within Arab circles and does not only apply to a Westeren wife. While you may have to have a tough skin and have to prove yourself all the time since you are not from the culture, you have the advantage of being excused for committing mistakes due to you being not from the culture.
The tense relationship between wife and mother-in-law is a continous theme throughout the Arab world. The husband’s mother feels that her son is the best and that his wife should feel priviliged to be with her son. Meanwhile, the wife feels that the mother in law is being entirely unreasonable in her demands. It comes down to the husband to be the shrewd politician to manage these affairs and ensure that they do not escalate.
Siwash – very interesting that you chose to focus on the relationship between a foreign wife and her Saudi MIL. My post is much more broad and did not mean the MIL at all but rather the whole extended family.
Thankfully in my own case my MIL is great and my biggest champion!
Colored38, Grow up you big cry baby. My God female what is your grip. You act like a baby. No one helps me waaaa. Stop bagging on Saudi’s no one made you marry your loser husband. Jerk.
Off to check the linguistic statistical likelihood of John and Waaa of the similar harsh comments mis-spelling the name of “their” target.
Or perhaps the Freudian slippiness of it.
Or perhaps a stylistic grammatical analysis of discourse of the few paltry sentences.
No, probably not worth the intellectual energy.
Waaaa – that comment was uncalled for and indicates you are replying without knowing any of the facts such as coolred was not even married to a Saudi.
Its my party and I will “waaaa!!!” if I want too…
Ive been hit by a troll…and its not even my blog…cool.
Let’s note that intellectually challenged trolls like ”waaaa”, and ”John” always prefer to remain anonymous and troll thier pathetic compulsions safely on the internet, neither would ever dare to declaim such crap right in your face.
Coolred38 and Aafke, you don’t own the internet so therefore calling people trolls is stupid and an indication of your lack of comprehension and ability to respond to John. You two just cry and whine about everything and really have nothing intelligent to add to this blog. Take a step back from your computer and take care of your kids.
ASA,
I’m a Grad Student at Morgan State University, Baltimore and I presenting a thesis photo exhibition on Islam and I need some high resolution color photos of a Saudi Muslim woman at her wedding , or celebration/festival such as Eid . One with a veil and one with niqab also. If you have any high resolution photos with of dates on a tree close up that would be good or food in a market place.
Jazakalahukhairun
J. Malik
Dear Jameelah,
I wish you the best in your efforts to acquire pictures. The majority of Saudi women would never share such pictures even if veiled because of the personal nature and fear of being photoshopped somehow.
If you search my blog, I have found excellent images from google of dates and fruit stands.
Regards, Carol